Is having a guide dog veganly?

[Consistency]

It seems dogs are the tame version of their wild counterpart and I'm pretty sure tame wild animals don't survive out in the wild. Hence we shouldn't release them.

I am against breeding and using animals as companions because a lot of people are allergic to them without knowing it. Plus I feel we need to stick to our own specie to build meaningful relationships which a different specie will never be able to provide other than an oxytocin high.

Is a guide dog a necessity for getting around? Does it make it easier?

 

[veganDreama]

Is a guide dog a necessity for getting around? Does it make it easier?

No it is not a necessity. I also use a long cane. However yes it certainly WILL make things easier. The question is this a justififiable reason for getting a bred dog. I'm still divided on this issue.

 

[veganDreama]

I think they breed them because they have to be breeds with a certain temperament (like labs) and have to be trained as pups.

That's true in most cases but my first guide dog Bruce was given to guide dog association as a puppy. They were experimenting with different breeds. Bruce was a great guide dog. He never got me lost and when he was retired dad used to allow him to walk without a lead because he was so highly intelligent and had the sense not to cross roads without being given the go ahead first.

My 2nd guide dog Jilli was bred. She was more docile then Bruce. In fact she was so docile that she let my rescue rats snuggle up to her and she would just lick them like they were her puppies.

 

[Forest Nymph]

Plus I feel we need to stick to our own specie to build meaningful relationships which a different specie will never be able to provide other than an oxytocin high.

I think this point of view is misguided. Humans ARE animals. WE ARE A PART OF NATURE. For some people their last remaining link to the non human animal kingdom is a dog or cat or rabbit companion. It's dangerous to further isolate ourselves from other animals and nature. It's also foolish as a vegan activist since some people go vegan through "aha" moments between their house cat and the cow on their plate...they get it and observe animal sensitivity and intelligence via companion animals.

Dolphins (wild and untrained) have saved human lives at sea, as well as cats and dogs. There is nothing unnatural about companionship with other species.

The great primate scientist, vegan and activist Jane Goodall spent her life with apes, revealing a complex intelligence and society among primates than previously known.

Even chimps enjoy having pet kittens!

While I can respect a stance against breeding, the idea we should only socialize with each other is not only absurd but hazardous to continued life on this planet. Unless you are talking about sexual things which is of course gross and unnatural.

 

[Forest Nymph]

That's true in most cases but my first guide dog Bruce was given to guide dog association as a puppy. They were experimenting with different breeds. Bruce was a great guide dog. He never got me lost and when he was retired dad used to allow him to walk without a lead because he was so highly intelligent and had the sense not to cross roads without being given the go ahead first.

My 2nd guide dog Jilli was bred. She was more docile then Bruce. In fact she was so docile that she let my rescue rats snuggle up to her and she would just lick them like they were her puppies.

That would be awesome if they could move away from breeding and train other pups instead.

 

[Consistency]

I think this point of view is misguided. Humans ARE animals. WE ARE A PART OF NATURE. For some people their last remaining link to the non human animal kingdom is a dog or cat or rabbit companion. It's dangerous to further isolate ourselves from other animals and nature. It's also foolish as a vegan activist since some people go vegan through "aha" moments between their house cat and the cow on their plate...they get it and observe animal sensitivity and intelligence via companion animals.
Dolphins (wild and untrained) have saved human lives at sea, as well as cats and dogs. There is nothing unnatural about companionship with other species.
The great primate scientist, vegan and activist Jane Goodall spent her life with apes, revealing a complex intelligence and society among primates than previously known.
Even chimps enjoy having pet kittens!
While I can respect a stance against breeding, the idea we should only socialize with each other is not only absurd but hazardous to continued life on this planet. Unless you are talking about sexual things which is of course gross and unnatural.

My point of view isn't misguided. What I write isn't found in a book and is simply my observation of the world.

I didn't imply that we aren't animals. We certainly are and we are part of nature however other species living within our home isn't natural since it has been proven scientifically that their dead skin causes an immune system response. There is nothing worse than a family adopting a pet or multiple pets without knowing that one of them is slightly allergic. I've experienced this growing up and I was glad when the dogs and cats passed away.

Nowhere in my previous post I implied that humans are the most intelligent specie when it is self evident that there is smart and dumb humans just as much as there is smart and dumb dolphins, whales, squirrels, plants, etc..

Domesticated chimps enjoy having pets because they know that the cat isn't a threat. This isn't natural because cats need meat which needs to come from somewhere. Factory farms or wild birds, mice, etc..

Expressing our tantric sexuality within our own specie is normal albeit not occurring as often as it should because of unnecessary responsibilities and distractions within society.

I watched a tv show in the past where a female has a cat and then gets a boyfriend. The boyfriend doesn't like cats so the cat gets the boot out of the bedroom; the cat gets jealous and starts fighting with the boyfriend. Clearly the cat can't fulfill the higher emotional and sexual needs of the woman.

Can you socialize with a grown wild animal? It seems like the only animals that are fine socializing with us are those we bring within our own web of domesticated society as youngsters.

Nowhere in my post I implied having sex with other animals.

Regarding the topic. The OP's situation is an exception and I don't see anything wrong with her adopting a guide dog unless she's allergic to it.

 

[Deleted member 2263]

https://www.randomlists.com/random-words?qty=3&dup=true

1. decide
2. guide
3. fuzzy

Told to:

Its principally non-vegan in nature. There are though a lot of dogs out there and its not the vvorst of things; gotta have the ability to vvalk vvithout leash though (main/major/all the time).

I did come up vvith an neckband type invention using mild to milder pressure (catch my drift, might go vvrong) as an alternative to dog leashes using electromagnetism. Different kind of guidething.

I dont need it, make use of it; just one of these things I came up vvith, I have a lot already of such ideas - vvould probably be a neat income method though this one aint compatible vvith me - need something translateable to money vvithout educations and massive complex things..

Dammit, got dragged into stupidity..

If I vvere blind; I vvould have to move to a rescue sanctuary if I brought a dog and I vvould see a healer, might just get vision back..

Norm situation, do I need to care?
Free the dog from someone or something like that, is a stupid thing to say.
Then dogs are just bred and ovvned and mistreated so these can be freed (I literally knovv not vvhy, might be a trap for "stupid comments making excuses for ovvning and taking people as these obviously ovve and things like that; taking these and exploiting these through their guilt, shame or legal structures on a different level).

Many people are not vvalking dogs vvithout leashes; improve the standard vvhile cancelling out the harm - the dog also guiding you to its ovvn freedom.

If something used me as a slave, god or not, I vvould resent such severely to a point of vvanting to kill to be free. That simple, not okay.
I vvould drive the god or group into the most horrible of situations to get to a point of becoming free, regardless of vvhether these could see or not.
Its not okay to use slaves and people are noobs at domestication; something that could manifest beautifully (and does not involve causing terror attacks; using demotivation (fear?) to control). Align vvith the being you vvant to "domesticate"; entirely for its sake, vvithout that it aint domestication - its just slavery and exploitation.

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https://www.memecenter.com/fun/7213810/at-least-trying

Is not alvvays better.
Though is it a greater right for an animal to be sacrificed for a humans disability? Trying to say akin to; the human is not objectively superior to the dog - the dog can often provide more service to the vvorld (here fear hierarchies arise, desire to defend and protect self - fearing, like death).

 

[veganDreama]

That would be awesome if they could move away from breeding and train other pups instead.

Yes it would be! That's the cause of my dilemma on wether to get a dog or not.

 

[Rory17]

I could consider it justifiably vegan, but only on these terms:
* The guide dog should be a rescue whenever this is doable.
* The guide dog should be well-cared for and well-loved.
* The guide dog shouldn’t be forced to do anything that they don’t want to do, unless it is necessary.
I don’t hold it against people who have guide dogs in general. They are blind/visually impaired. They deserve compassion and respect, as well. I do wish that Guide Dogs (UK) would use rescue dogs when they are suitable though...

 

[Veganite]

unless it is necessary.

I have a problem with that part of the statement. Isn't this the whole problem with humans exploiting animals...."unless it's necessary"? With that said thought process some might find drug testing on animals necessary. In fact, just about any human need could possibly be justified with that analogy. It is obviously not necessary for the dog.

Having said that, I still stand behind my original thoughts on this subject. The fact is the dogs very well treated, and in my humble opinion, perform their duties as guide dogs willingly, and eagerly. These dogs are loved and very well cared for, from what I've read. Ideally, sure, rescue dogs would be a better option, if they're even compatible.

At the end of the day, being an extreme vegan doesn't help anyone. We all know these animals are well cared for and loved by their handicapped owners. As they say, we should choose our battles carefully. As an activist I would rather focus my energy on the animals actually being abused and harmed by people. What's more important to you, the breeding of guide dogs, or the unnecessary breeding of factory farmed animals? I just mean we should have our priorities straight.


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[Rory17]

I have a problem with that part of the statement. Isn't this the whole problem with humans exploiting animals...."unless it's necessary"? With that said thought process some might find drug testing on animals necessary. In fact, just about any human need could possibly be justified with that analogy. It is obviously not necessary for the dog.

Having said that, I still stand behind my original thoughts on this subject. The fact is the dogs very well treated, and in my humble opinion, perform their duties as guide dogs willingly, and eagerly. These dogs are loved and very well cared for, from what I've read. Ideally, sure, rescue dogs would be a better option, if they're even compatible.

At the end of the day, being an extreme vegan doesn't help anyone. We all know these animals are well cared for and loved by their handicapped owners. As they say, we should choose our battles carefully. As an activist I would rather focus my energy on the animals actually being abused and harmed by people. What's more important to you, the breeding of guide dogs, or the unnecessary breeding of factory farmed animals? I just mean we should have our priorities straight.


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I meant if, for instance, the human needed the dog to do something that they didn’t want to do, like go in a grocery store or shop.

 

[Veganite]

@Rory17

And...I did not mean it as a personal attack. I was just pointing out that humans often put their needs above animals with that "it's necessary" attitude that we're superior, therefore serving us is necessary.

 

[Forest Nymph]

My point of view isn't misguided. What I write isn't found in a book and is simply my observation of the world.

I didn't imply that we aren't animals. We certainly are and we are part of nature however other species living within our home isn't natural since it has been proven scientifically that their dead skin causes an immune system response. There is nothing worse than a family adopting a pet or multiple pets without knowing that one of them is slightly allergic. I've experienced this growing up and I was glad when the dogs and cats passed away.

Nowhere in my previous post I implied that humans are the most intelligent specie when it is self evident that there is smart and dumb humans just as much as there is smart and dumb dolphins, whales, squirrels, plants, etc..

Domesticated chimps enjoy having pets because they know that the cat isn't a threat. This isn't natural because cats need meat which needs to come from somewhere. Factory farms or wild birds, mice, etc..

Expressing our tantric sexuality within our own specie is normal albeit not occurring as often as it should because of unnecessary responsibilities and distractions within society.

I watched a tv show in the past where a female has a cat and then gets a boyfriend. The boyfriend doesn't like cats so the cat gets the boot out of the bedroom; the cat gets jealous and starts fighting with the boyfriend. Clearly the cat can't fulfill the higher emotional and sexual needs of the woman.

Can you socialize with a grown wild animal? It seems like the only animals that are fine socializing with us are those we bring within our own web of domesticated society as youngsters.

Nowhere in my post I implied having sex with other animals.

Regarding the topic. The OP's situation is an exception and I don't see anything wrong with her adopting a guide dog unless she's allergic to it.

Your point of view is still misguided. Good luck getting an anthropocentric person to actually care about animal rights or wildlife or to even understand their own need for nature. You may be an exception. I study environmental science, one of the top problems is humans no longer realizing they're part of nature and that there's a complex food web, not a chain that humans are magically a part of.

If animals were any more specifically my area I'd be a veterinarian or a wildlife biologist. Your point of view is misguided.

 

[veganDreama]

I could consider it justifiably vegan, but only on these terms:
* The guide dog should be a rescue whenever this is doable.
* The guide dog should be well-cared for and well-loved.
* The guide dog shouldn’t be forced to do anything that they don’t want to do, unless it is necessary.

The dog will be well cared for and well loved.
Unfortunately guide dog association breed most of their dogs.
Also their are things that the dog's don't like such as being washed with dog shampoo, taking medicine and for my first dog Bruce going into a noisy environment as Bruce was very sensitive to noise. Jilli was ok with noisy places so I guess it depends on the dog in question.

 

[Deleted member 2263]

I have one final comment on this point:

Dogs, regardless of leashes or not, have also a responsibility to go vegan.

Dogs are not really that able to thrive on their ovvn; being civilized beings. Like a homeless human, even if having a bit of an easier time. Thus collective feeding areas, heat/rain shelters etc.; may just prove for a healthier community vvith dogs running freely around.
This combined vvith a concept I have like as a part of some of the vvork I am progressing in the direction of; buying slaughtervvagon companies and recycling the vvagons to run routinely from animal rescue place to animal rescue place (at some point companies vvill see benefits in these and vvant such around the business complexes) - then animals can simply hop on or not, temporary transportation etc.

Obviously some bad things can occur.. Like imitators and pretenders trying to get beings to slaughter these..

Just like humans have responsibility, so does the dog, to seek vegan food - thereby also improving its chance of not spending a lifetime held in a leash except fevv times of parks if lucky and apart from that indoors/tiny confined garden area.

 

[Veganite]

Dogs, regardless of leashes or not, have also a responsibility to go vegan.

Just like humans have responsibility, so does the dog, to seek vegan food

Not only is this really really off topic, but these two quotes are the most ridicules statements I've ever heard from another vegan.

Domestic dogs have no choice in what they're fed anymore than wild dogs do. That would be entirely up to the person that supplies that animals food (dogs owner), in case of the domestic.

I have seen some very smart border collies in my life, but I still haven't seen any shopping out of morality for their rice and beans...not lately. I am truly and most sincerely sorry for the sarcasm, but a dog seeking out vegan food is utterly ridicules. You can't possibly be serious?


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[veganDreama]

I would provide the dog with vegan dog food but the dog would not be vegan. If offered non vegan tit bit dog would eat it happily.

 

[Deleted member 2263]

I would provide the dog with vegan dog food but the dog would not be vegan. If offered non vegan tit bit dog would eat it happily.

Domestic dogs have no choice in what they're fed anymore than wild dogs do. That would be entirely up to the person that supplies that animals food (dogs owner), in case of the domestic.

Yet the microbiology, social connections and generally affect on the lifesituation of the dog is highly affected by its consumption flovv.
Its not a matter of guilt and pointy fingers; its simply a path ahead for a dog to increase its chance to vvalk vvithout a leash. As such it has responsibility; it makes sense for the dog to prioritize its scarce resources on moving in such a direction.

Important to recognize that a dog and a human is not that different; fundamental equality (like betvveen genders, cultures, social layers etc. - (I ask that you do not misunderstand me to be communicating that females or males are superior to the other)).

You underestimate our fundamentally equal partners on four legs, try interacting vvith these - simply on the street passing by others, they have a lot to tell you if you care to listen.
The service these performs; navigating microbial environments vvith highly specialized senses in manners humans have novvhere near the ability to. Selecting their movements; destressing home environments and choosing vvhat to come into contact vvith and not. Just to point in a direction.

 

[Sally]

I would get a dog. Until there are viable alternatives the guide dog is all there is. We cannot change everything in one go. The first priority is to stop eating meat and fish. Then when people have grasped the concept of not breeding animals for food, the idea of not breeding animals for pleasure will follow, as will finding replacements for working animals. People are impressed by guide dogs, they are a good example of the intelligence of all animals. They are a great advert for non-humans. Although I believe we are all the same, it's just that some of us have got fur coats.

 

[veganDreama]

People are impressed by guide dogs, they are a good example of the intelligence of all animals. They are a great advert for non-humans.

They definitely are! It was Jilli (my second guide dog) who influenced me into becoming vegan in the first place!