Is society going to Hell in a handbasket?

[Second Summer]

I'm curious if it's just me getting older, grumpier and more knowledgeable about the inevitable shortcomings of human society OR is western society actually going downhill fast?

Consider e.g. the state of news media and the state of politics.

In the news media we see declining quality, increasing tabloidization, ever fewer local newspapers, coupled with monopoly tendencies on the ownership side. In the UK we've had these phone hacking scandals where journalists have hacked into the phones of royals as well as ordinary people in search of juicy news stories. Also, news media appears to have abandoned the idea of doing much in terms of their own research. Inaccurate news reported by one news source are often picked up and passed on by others without fact checking.

And then there is politics. Consider the influence of special interest groups. Consider the declining quality of political discourse. The lack of substance. The polarization where politicians feel it necessary to take ever more ridiculously extreme and tabloid-friendly stances, to not compromise even if it means shutting down government services.

What do you think?

 

[Andy_T]

Of course!

Why are you even asking?

 

[KLS52]

It would seem so. I don't like the direction we are going.

 

[Second Summer]

Why are you even asking?

I read something on some progressive / radical website saying something to the effect that us old grumps need to confront our own misconceptions about the state of society. So I just wanted to do a reality check.

 

[Andy_T]

Aw, come on, it's nothing new...

My grandparents told me the same thing some 40 years ago.

 

[Moll Flanders]

I think sometimes the older you get the more you think society is changing for the worst. It doesn't help that you can look at what is happening anywhere in the world from your phone now which you couldn't do when I was younger.

If I was trying to be optimistic I would say for the UK I think things are improving as there is less violence in society, more people are becoming vegetarian and vegan, there is less open racism, sexism etc...

Globally extreme poverty is falling. World Bank Forecasts Global Poverty to Fall Below 10% for First Time; Major Hurdles Remain in Goal to End Poverty by 2030

 

[Andy_T]

Just think about the rate of veganism specifically among younger members of the society today.
Definitely a positive thread.

 

[beancounter]

Every generation thinks things aren't as good as they used to be back in the old days...

 

[Second Summer]

Every generation thinks things aren't as good as they used to be back in the old days...

Perhaps they are correct?!

Just think about the rate of veganism specifically among younger members of the society today.
Definitely a positive thread.

Is it, though? I seem to recall the percentage of vegans has not really increased at all ...! Despite how much easier it is to be vegan these days.

 

[shyvas]

http://www.cracked.com/article/18355_the-top-10-decades-century-how-2000s-compared/

 

[Andy_T]

http://www.cracked.com/article/18355_the-top-10-decades-century-how-2000s-compared/

Well, their logic why the 1940's were the best decade of all the past century only makes sense from a very US-centric perspective (if at all).

"Wait," you might say, "that was a giant WAR. There was a Holocaust, atomic bombs--people MELTED, man."

It was a different time.

All true, but as far as U.S. involvement goes, it was justified. And we won. WWII is basically the reason people still like America, even after Michael Bay made Pearl Harbor.

Does not seem to be a very enlightened choice to me personally.....

 

[Mischief]

I'm an old fart, and I think that things are gradually (very gradually) improving.

Yellow "journalism" has been around as long as journalism has been around. People have always been idiots who are easily led by their noses. We've had worse politicians than we have now (think of the McCarthy era in the U.S. as just one not so distant example). None of these things is new.

We've made substantial progress in rights for women, minorities, etc. I didn't expect to see a time when same sex marriage would be legal, and yet here we are.

People's attitudes towards non-human animals are also changing, even if that change is excruciatingly slow.

 

[KLS52]

We're not nice enough to each other as people. There's too much retaliation and ridicule and hate, every time differences of opinion pop up, be the differences big or small. I'm sure access to the Internet plays into this.

 

[Andy_T]

I had already posted this in the "Gripe" thread, but it fits here...

I have a hard time to accept how inconsiderate and impolite many people are, today.
Everybody only seems to be looking out for his own benefit, and negative consequences to others be damned.
(And with this I do not even mean the abuse of animals. That is to be expected)

I sometimes get into long discussions with my wife, when I demand that our kids behave in a polite and considerate way. "You are always only nice to OTHER people AND ANIMALS, but not to your own family"
If my kids behave badly and disturb other people, I rather ask them to stop that behaviour.
Even if other parents, whose kids do the same thing, like running around playing catch in a restaurant or taking everything from the buffet regardless whether they will like it or even be able to finish it, do not admonish their kids.
My wife insists that if I then suggest to my kids to behave politely, it is actually an implied criticism (and hence an insult) to those other people who let their kids do as they please. (Which would not be amiss in my book, anyway)

But I see it in normal people in everyday situations ... there is little consideration for the fact that ones action might have negative consequences for others...

 

[KLS52]

My wife insists that if I then suggest to my kids to behave politely, it is actually an implied criticism (and hence an insult) to those other people who let their kids do as they please. (Which would not be amiss in my book, anyway)
.

I take no issue with the implied criticism, in this case, either.

Pretty much every choice we make comes with an implied judgement.

I choose to live a mostly vegan lifestyle. I accept and love my omni family/friends but I'm totally judging their choice not to. They're wrong, IMO but I'm not going to try and sway them by attacking and criticizing them. I'm more of a sneaky gentle nudger. [emoji1]

I have three friends who I'm currently helping to make the transition. It's very exciting!

 

[Mischief]

I take no issue with the implied criticism, in this case, either.

Pretty much every choice we make comes with an implied judgement.

This.

Does your wife object to feeding your children a healthy diet, discouraging them from promiscuous sex/drugs/etc. at a young age, etc.? Because by setting out those kind of ground rules, you're (by implication) criticizing all those parents who don't....

 

[Moll Flanders]

Our Requisite Thanksgiving Gratitude - The Resume Gap

Very positive.

 

[KLS52]

Thanks...I needed that.
[emoji4]