Killing or Eating Predators Dilemma

Natural predators (lions, tigers, wolves, etc.) kill differently than humans. Humans will pick the biggest, strongest, healthiest animal in a herd. Natural predators pick out the sick and weaker animals from the herd. This is a natural process that prevents overpopulation by species.

You can see the devastation when predators are removed, or a fast breeding animal is introduced to an area that doesn't have natural predators.

Predators, in the wild, keep nature in balance. They are well suited to this environment.

When we can chow down on a week old, raw, rotting carcass, then we can call ourselves carnivores.
 
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Clairey said:
The Next Door website was on the subject of foxes taking peoples pet cats. It is a community webpage. I am not with it any more but just remembered where i had seen it.
It was not just one or two people saying they had that experience it was common place.
I just tried googleing it and there was not anything on the subject but i know what i read and those people knew that was what was happening.
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The only thing that would surprise me about this would be if they didn't mention the other things that can kill cats if they go outdoors- mainly, but not necessarily limited to, motor vehicles. My parents had 7 cats. I barely remember the first one, whom they got when I was about 4 and died from some illness soon after; I don't think they even had this one long enough to give them a name. Of the other 6 (5 of whom were outside frequently) two were definitely killed by cars. I found a third laying dead beside the house one night, bleeding from the mouth; we assumed she was hit also. The second cat they adopted came home one night with a bad wound on his throat and died within a year; in retrospect, I think he might have been infected with feline leukemia. So 4 of their 5 "frequently outdoor" cats had their lives cut short.

But as far as predation from non-human predators is concerned... I could definitely support large preserves for herbivores, with predators kept out and the herbivores' population/reproduction controlled.

Mikkel said:
Killing predators will ruin the ecosystem so many places. The nature is best being left alone, with no interference of human being. Some animals are carnivore, we need to live and accept that.

To kill pretators means litterally wiping out so much of the animals that are on this planet. And that's not even vegetarian, vegan or etihical in any way. It's no difference between killing a deer than a wolf, even though you put into some justice in your thoughts with "well, then the deer wouldn't be eaten by the wolf".
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Consider: Elephants and Rhinoceroses have no significant predators... and yet, they do not generally overpopulate and ruin the ecosystem. African lions, North American brown bears, Orca whales, and eagles have no significant predators (other than humans)- yet, they don't overpopulate. I believe that most herbivores reproduce so prolifically in the first place because of predation pressure.
 
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Clairey said:
Daily Telegraph February 2005 Hungry foxes start eating the nations cats. Google that if you are able to.
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I googled it and could find nothing except this:

Is it likely that a fox will attack me, my child, my cat or my dog? | Wildlife Online

Fox “attacks”, usually minor bites, on people are extremely rare and, generally speaking, foxes are not a threat to humans. The number of attacks on cats and dogs each year is unknown, but seem to be of only minor significance relative to attacks on each other (i.e. dog on cat, or cat on cat). Typically foxes and cats ignore one another and fights are rarely observed.
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The reason I asked about it is because most domestic cats are larger than most foxes so it seems unlikely that they can drag them away. I also can't understand how this can lead to bigger cats as you said in another thread. You might be right of course and I will continue to research, but I can't understand how it is possible.

In February 2005, the Daily Telegraph carried the headline “Hungry foxes start eating the nation’s cats” and the accompanying article told how fox attacks on cats were on the increase and quoted a pest controller near Edinburgh who explained that the fox population has gotten out of hand because the introduction of wheelie bins has deprived foxes of their regular food supply. As we have discussed already, there is no evidence of this, so if the number of fox attacks on cats has increased (or is increasing) it seems the reason lies elsewhere.


There are few data sets to tell us how many cats are attacked by foxes each year, not least because positively identifying the culprit as a fox (as opposed to a small dog, for example) is difficult. Probably the most off-cited statistics on the subject come from Bristol University. Stephen Harris distributed 5,480 questionnaires asking about fox disturbance, including losses of pets to houses in an area of north-west Bristol estimated to be home to 1,225 pet cats. Harris received 5,191 (95%) completed surveys and calculated that eight (less than 1%) of these pet cats, most being kittens less than eight months old, were thought to have been killed by foxes.
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In our area, coyotes have moved into suburbia, and frequently take cats and small dogs. Bobcats and even raccoons can kill small pets.
I do wish people would keep their cats inside, as the songbird population has struggled fir years....
 
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The Bristol research is out of date.
I am in the uk, yourself in Sweden, that could be the difference in the news stories.
There are stories also about foxes going in peoples houses and hurting people, sometimes they go in through a window.
Big cats are on the increase in the uk. I put the two things together myself.
 
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vesper818 said:
In our area, coyotes have moved into suburbia, and frequently take cats and small dogs. Bobcats and even raccoons can kill small pets.
I do wish people would keep their cats inside, as the songbird population has struggled fir years....
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These innocent creatures have no other alternative as their natural habitat lacks food and water. It's up to us human beings to protect
our pets as coyotes and bobcats hunt for food. That's what they do in the wild so their habits will not change when they end up in suburbia.
 
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Clairey said:
The Bristol research is out of date.

There are stories also about foxes going in peoples houses and hurting people, sometimes they go in through a window.
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These are very rare and isolated incidents. There are far more incidents (including serious wounds) with dogs biting children. I'd be far more worried that a child should get abducted or be in a car accident than getting bitten by a fox.

Foxs have moved into suburbia as they can no longer survive in the countryside. Moreover, there are still illegal fox hunts going on. They naturally are frightened of human beings and very often end up dead along the roadside as they cannot assess the danger of our busy roads. It's a tough life for a fox to live in suburbia and our very few animal rescuers are swamped with 24 h rescues.

There is a lot of conflicting information concerning big or wild cats living in the UK. There is very little data on the sightings of these animals and it's believed that they may have been released by certain zoos and also wildlife parks due to a change in the law during the 70's. However, people must bear in mind that these animals are more frightened of humans and they usually live in woodland.

Humans have done far more harm to animals by destroying their natural habitat. Hence, it's up to us to accept them living in suburbia and also to help them. Thankfully, there are many rescue groups in various areas who work endlessly so that our wildlife can be safe.
 
shyvas said:
These innocent creatures have no other alternative as their natural habitat lacks food and water. It's up to us human beings to protect
our pets as coyotes and bobcats hunt for food. That's what they do in the wild so their habits will not change when they end up in suburbia.
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There was another big cat sighting near the Wiltshire border on the A303 in the last few days.
 
shyvas said:
I hope that it's safe and sound. Any large animal near a busy road is a danger to the public and itself.
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Theres been sightings of them over the years since Mary Chipperfield's Circus were said to have released 2 or 3 animals in Devon in the 1970's.
The Beast of Bodmin Moor is quite a well known story.
The sightings are now getting more frequent and all over the UK. Often a black big cat that has been seen.
They are probably a bit wary of vehicles and people.
 
Humans are the worst predators of all and kill the most animals. If you remove humans nature will eventually balance itself again and billions of animals will be saved. It's kind of ironic and hypocritical that a human wants to kill other predators to save animals. :fp:
 
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Calliegirl said:
Humans are the worst predators of all and kill the most animals. If you remove humans nature will eventually balance itself again and billions of animals will be saved. It's kind of ironic and hypocritical that a human wants to kill other predators to save animals. :fp:
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All the creatures eat each other for some strange reason. Humans included. I do not know if that is how God meant it to be. Ido not think removing the human beings would make any difference, the animals would still carry on eating each other.
 
Some animals eat other animals. But some animals eat plants. It is necessary that there are animals that eat photosynthesizing organisms, if there are any animals. If animals only ate animals it could not last as they would die out, none of them produce nutrients. Our nutrients are ultimately from plants, or the B12 just coming from soil bacteria. But it could happen that all animals just ate food from plants. Predators are around keeping herbivore populations from overpopulating. But having pets that are predators is not sustainable for the natural world. It is not well to keep feeding them food from animals, and not good for environment to let them catch animals.
 
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