The Democrats USA (2018-2020)

Jamie in Chile said:
I don't know how many candidates are officially still in, but really we are looking at Biden, Sanders, Warren, Bloomberg, Buttigieg.

The current odds here: US Presidential Election 2020 Democrat Candidate Betting Odds | Politics

Warren was the favourite some months ago, but not any more. According to the bookmakers Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders are the top two now.

It's funny how someone goes up or down in the polls/bookmaker odds without doing any great, without any scandal or gaffes, or announcing new policies, just because of some vague sense of momentum or how well they are doing.

I think the Democrats have totally failed to even try to learn anything strategically speaking from 2016. Overall I think as usual the left wing have the better and more just policies but no sense of strategy.
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I am a Bernie supporter and I have been since 2016, but because of his age and how much people hate him, Elizabeth Warren is the second person I would vote for if I could see she had a strong chance of defeating clueless Biden. I will absolutely not vote for Joe Biden. I will show up on election day, vote for all leftist "other" open positions etc and write in AOC for the presidential nom, just to be obnoxious.

I honestly find the establishment's backing of Biden with his glaring flaws deeply offensive. If they hate Bernie so much they could at least stop being total hypocrites and voice support for a slightly-less-challenging and female candidate like Elizabeth Warren. These are the same liars who said they couldn't wait to see a woman as president.

Nah, they just wanted Hillary because of her Young Republicans street cred.
 
Unfortunately, Elizabeth Warren's campaign looks stranger and stranger. This article does raise a few good points:

www.pastemagazine.com

Elizabeth Warren's Campaign Is Now About Keeping Bernie Sanders From Winning

Paste Magazine is your source for the best music, movies, TV, comedy, videogames, books, comics, craft beer, politics and more. Discover your favorite albums and films.
www.pastemagazine.com www.pastemagazine.com

Shane Ryan said:
To summarize:

1. She can’t win, either on her own merits or at a brokered convention.
2. She’s staying in, and people close to her have said it’s about “blunting” the Sanders momentum.
3. She’s publicly attacking Sanders after every primary.
4. She’s taking dark super PAC money that may be coming from anti-Bernie sources.
5. She won’t drop out even if she bombs on Super Tuesday.

When you look at the overwhelming evidence, how can you reach any conclusion but the most obvious one? Elizabeth Warren, having failed to run a successful campaign, is now out to prevent Bernie Sanders from winning. Somewhere, Joe Biden is smiling.
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The strongest question mark to me here is that after her strong insistence that she would never accept SuperPac money for her campaign, just now, when her chances of winning are no longer existing by any realistic estimate, she has received the largest amount so far from a SuperPac ($14 mil) that was founded only weeks ago and thus does not have to disclose its backers until the end of March :mad:
 
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Elizabeth Warren is coming up for too much criticism for me. I respect her campaign, I think it made no sense to pull out before Tuesday with all those votes coming up (surprised Pete did it), it was obvious by Tuesday night she would pull out, and she's quite rightly taken time to think this over and make sure it's the right decision and ignore social media and press that would have demanded an instant announcement by Wednesday morning.

I think it's sad that we have managed to get all the way from 1781 to now at least 2025 without a female President. Obviously Warren shouldn't have been chosen for that reasons, but 1781 to 2025 - that is a long time.
 
I see it as being trapped in a high rise building, that's being filling with increasing amounts of toxic air. Half the people are in complete denial of the danger. For the rest, it's a choice of either staying outside on the balcony, where they can breath again, but are still trapped, or jumping onto an outstretched net that promises a new start.
Even those who really want a new start keep getting talked back from everyones fear. Fear loves company!
 
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silva said:
I see it as being trapped in a high rise building, that's being filling with increasing amounts of toxic air. Half the people are in complete denial of the danger. For the rest, it's a choice of either staying outside on the balcony, where they can breath again, but are still trapped, or jumping onto an outstretched net that promises a new start.
Even those who really want a new start keep getting talked back from everyones fear. Fear loves company!
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It is not going to change for this election. Joe Biden is Hillary: The Sequel except worse. So it's definitely a horror movie sequel. He is already outright insulting Bernie Sanders supporters and talking about protesters like they're criminals. This crap doesn't work anymore, but they keep doing it. They think this kind of 1960s-1980s kind of hierarchical social bullying and worship of capitalism is going to work, but it won't. It's truly disturbing to me, the stuff that Joe Biden is saying, starting with his "Bernie Brothers" rhetoric...as though ardent Bernie supporters are all privileged white males in their late teens and early twenties, and not a diverse, multi-racial, multi-generational movement of working people:


"Then as a member of the crowd tried to tear away the banner, Biden said, “That’s OK, let him go. This is not a Trump rally. Let him go, let him go. The Bernie Bros are here. Let him go.”

Minutes later, a larger group of pro-Green New Deal demonstrators began shouting over Biden’s remarks and waving signs."

It's just bad campaigning to start doing the "deplorables" dance that Hillary did 2016, except target it towards 35 year old Bernie supporters. That's not going to go over well at all.

Another Hillary, Hillary Rosin, told the adult, grown ***, college educated, employed African American co-chair of the Sanders campaign that she didn't have "standing" to criticize Joe Biden using a quote from MLK. Nina Turner was actually correct, and Rosin was incorrect in her phrasing of the MLK quote - which should be the most embarrassing part of this for Hillary Rosin and Joe Biden supporters...except it's not even the worse part. It's that a Biden pundit literally talked down to a 52 year old progressive Black lady with a career in politics like it was her job to do so. She was so smug when she did it - she thought she was totally in the right to behave in this manner. It beggars all belief. Was it her race? Her class? Did Rosin think that Nina Turner was 32 instead of 52 (not that that's even okay, note my comments in the OK Boomer thread on this subject).

It's a ******* nightmare. Because at least Hillary had her wits about her, and she was worshiped by a certain type of woman, you know Hillary had this whole presence like HILLARY. Joe Biden, as liked as he is by some people, does not have even that glory to cover his butt.

This is gonna be real bad.
 
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This is what Centrists need to do, immediately. They need to drop the whole elitist "back in my day" talk. Like it really has to go, because while it may delight your core audience, those independents you want to attract may be ex-Republicans who are very sensitive to the liberal elite, and aren't having any of your nonsense today. Same with Sanders supporters, especially ones born between the late 70s and late 90s, but even taking a nod at older supporters like Jane Fonda: look at the mentality of Sanders supporters. Look. At. Us. NO REALLY. We aren't going to be responsive to you dismissing our very real, very adult concerns by laughing away our protests or trying to paint us as unruly children.

Poor people have less to lose. The ones who are really desperate do not care about restoring your middle class status quo. Sure there are closet-Bernie Black voters who will push Biden out of absolute fear of Trump's America in the South (note that Uncle Joe rose in the Southern states, where people are still more easily dictated by fear, because well, it's the Middle Ages down there). Yes, you have that contingent, you have those middle class Black Southerners who like Bernie, but afraid for their son being stopped by a traffic cop and "accidentally" dying so they will support Biden out of fear. But many, many Sanders supporters will not allow you as Centrists to treat them that way.

Centrists REALLY need to watch their dang mouths. They've got an image problem. They don't even try to hide what money grubbing, CEO brown nosing, filthy capitalist, ageist, classist snobs they are. You don't start calling people with legitimate concerns about climate change and health care "Bernie Brothers" who will "spread negativity" this early in the campaign, then claim to be a "bridge builder." You've got to listen to people's concerns and think about why they might be protesting, or don't want to vote for you. You don't tell people who you don't agree with that they don't have "standing" to disagree with you, unless you're talking about something objectively verifiable like science or math or medicine. Because otherwise you're talking to a person like they're a servant, or a slave, or a disobedient child at best.

I mean, I honestly think a lot of older centrists are out of touch with reality. They are sooooo comfortable that they really really really don't realize how bad it is for working people in this country, in terms of debt, and health care, and basics like housing. When people are like "er you just want a perfect candidate" I'm just like, no, I am not going to support a candidate who is basically a complete piece of **** as a human being. I DO get the "anyone but Trump" mentality, but on the other hand, I understand exactly why the centrist game isn't going to work. The fact that you do not scares me. Because it means we are going to lose. Again.

There's something fundamentally wrong with the fact that the candidate supported by the Dem establishment in both 2016 and now think it's cool to talk down to or to talk crap about VOTERS. Hillary Clinton did it, now Joe Biden is doing it. Bernie Sanders condemns candidates behavior, or stuff that's truly awful (like the Nazi flag) but he doesn't go around making fun of voters. What bitchy high school mentality is this? What aristocratic group of narcissistic wealthy and upper middle class old people think this is fine? It's not a good look. More importantly, it's not a winning look. Fear-monger all you want, but if you keep trashing voters, you'll pay the price. Insulting peasants is so passe.
 
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KLS52 said:
FYI, don’t read too much into this other than Trump turns my stomach.
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I understand your point of view. I really do. I am as traumatized by Trump as many people. I had this weird moment in 2016 where I wanted the electoral college immediately dissolved so that Hillary Clinton could be my president, no matter my personal views on the matter. Trust me. I have suffered greatly over the past four years, and realize my emotional and mental suffering is only that of a person with scientific knowledge living in a physical comfortable life, while grandfathers and mothers and upstanding citizens of my country were deported or threatened with separation from their families. I get it.

On the other hand, my point is - and maybe I did not make this clear in my emotional rambling - we're not going to beat Trump if moderates and centrists belittle Sanders supporters. As a Sanders supporter, I have personal insight into the world view. I have both an emotional and intellectual assessment of the situation. My emotional assessment of the situation is "**** you" and my intellectual assessment is "I'm going to do the right thing to out Trump no matter what, but lots of other people won't because they either don't share my education or my life experience, or they're so desperate they have less to lose than I, and they would let Trump level America before they'd vote for rich/upper middle class people talking down to them."

The idea here is to embrace the Sanders supporters. Someone in the WaPo FINALLY acknowledged this today (I almost cancelled my sub, I already cancelled the NY Times, but I feel like only trusting the LA Times is biased) ...it's really toxic to belittle the concerns of women of color, homeless families, inner city residents with 2-3 horrible low wage jobs they take just to survive, middle class homeowners dying of cancer who can't afford their own healthcare, and scientists (or science students like me) who know we need faster action on climate change.

Moderates really need to stop the anti-Sanders garbage. Or at least stop calling his supporters Bernie Brothers and expecting them to OBEY. Cuz they won't. These people have real concerns (so do I) but people with even realer concerns than I will not help the Dems beat Trump unless you reach out to them without judgment.
 
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If Biden picks someone like Stacey Abrams I'll be okay. If he chooses pretty much anyone of his newfound endorsers (Amy, Pete, Kamala) I will not be ok :dismay: :sigh:.
Silly old Corey Booker, What IS he thinking?
What happened Warren??????
The 'left' is so far right it's lost
 
With the Michigan results I am afraid it's more or less over for Bernie Sanders (am not going to bring a hope like "Robert Kennedy was assassinated in June" like Hillary did in 2008), and all we can hope for is that there will be so much overwhelming sentiment against Dump in November that the much-echoed sentiment "A roomba would win over Trump" becomes a reality.
 
The full Biden-Sanders debate:
edition.cnn.com

Watch the full CNN-Univision Democratic debate from Washington, DC | CNN

Former Vice President Joe Biden and Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders faced off in the first one-on-one debate of the 2020 presidential primary. Because of the coronavirus outbreak, the debate had no audience, and in accordance with CDC guidelines, their podiums were 6 feet apart.
edition.cnn.com edition.cnn.com
 
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I watched most of the debate. I skipped some of part 2 and all of part 3 (parts as detailed in link above).

The Biden gaffes are not materialising - at least not in this debate. It was actually Sanders who said Ebola virus (twice) instead of coronavirus.

It was interesting to see Sanders talk straight ahead in the whole debate except the climate change part where he turned to the side and just looked at and challenged Biden head on. He obviously won that part of the debate if you know climate science, but I'm not sure that this would have come through to the average American.

I think Sanders won the debate to me in the sense I agree with him more and like him better, but in actual performance, and to the average American, I think it was a draw.
 
Well predictively Tulsi is out

Ihttps://time.com/5806491/tulsi-gabbard-suspends-presidential-campaign/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=the-brief-pm&utm_content=20200319&xid=newsletter-brief
 
I've said all along that progressives are a much smaller part of the American electorate than most progressives realize.
 
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