Hope for Vegans in Jesus

[peacefulveglady]

I like the church because at the end of the day, boots on the ground it is churches running the homeless shelters, the food banks, the food pantries, the meals, showers for the homeless, laundry for the homeless, the food rescuing programs, the clothing handouts, etc. Atheists love to pretend to take the moral high ground, but they aren't preparing meals every day in every city and town in the USA. They aren't handing out toothbrushes, razors, and tampons. They don't want to get their hands dirty. They don't want to actually stand directly in front of poverty and try to give simple understanding gesture and help other than maybe giving a beggar $2.

There are county food banks for all walks of life to volunteer at. It not just churches that pass out free food to the poor and needy. Most churches believe in passing out animal products because thier Bible states that God wanted them to have and animal products.
I find its harder to go to a church pantry as a vegan.

 

[Genuinethedude]

There are county food banks for all walks of life to volunteer at. It not just churches that pass out free food to the poor and needy. Most churches believe in passing out animal products because thier Bible states that God wanted them to have and animal products.
I find its harder to go to a church pantry as a vegan.

Our church partners with a food ministry that will rescue any and all food that a grocery store is willing to give, there is no scripture involved. We usually have vegan choices galore, and are completely unable to give away soy/oat milk and faux meat/cheese which we get with nearly every shipment. We always have fresh fruit and vegetables, and prepare shipments from farm to food pantry of imperfect produce that farmers would throw in a hole in the ground otherwise. I could have an unlimited supply if I asked. I would much rather already existing animal products go to people who would be willing to use them then a landfill.

But if I showed a list of food banks and pantries, there would be one secular public option citywide, and an entire page of churches stepping up, every single day. Not to say atheists don't volunteer in the churches, they do a lot, and we love them for it. It's just atheists don't have large clubhouses to hang out at to provide services from.

 

[silva]

I like the church because at the end of the day, boots on the ground it is churches running the homeless shelters, the food banks, the food pantries, the meals, showers for the homeless, laundry for the homeless, the food rescuing programs, the clothing handouts, etc. Atheists love to pretend to take the moral high ground, but they aren't preparing meals every day in every city and town in the USA. They aren't handing out toothbrushes, razors, and tampons. They don't want to get their hands dirty. They don't want to actually stand directly in front of poverty and try to give simple understanding gesture and help other than maybe giving a beggar $2.

Oh. Your. God.
That is simply an untruth. There are lots of humanist run food pantries, shelters, rehabs, free medical clinics, domestic violence shelters, law advice and pro-bona services, as well as clean needles, birth control, abortions, prenatal care, counseling.
Of course religious run charities have their advantages--they are tax exempt, and allowed to pick and choose who they help, and limit the help to their own tailored agendas.

 

[silva]

...and then there's the ones that feel a need to insert their special beliefs spoiling an otherwise nice thread, in an otherwise secular forum.

 

[Genuinethedude]

When I was homeless I was rejected by every state run program at DSHS from EBT to Healthcare because I worked and was going to school. I told them I was literally starving (1 week without food) and while I was crying they literally handed me a list of churches. They tore up my applications in front of me and offered me condoms (I was celibate.) Churches would literally put toiletries and food on the hood of my car while I was sleeping in it. I figured out really fast who really cared about me.

I don't forget my life debts. The church kept me feed, clothed, let me sleep on church property, provided me showers and meals. Even the cultish denominations showed me nothing but grace.

 

[FredVegrox]

All right, a vegan believer! Praise God. Me too, I'm a vegan believer. Yeah a diet of only plants matches the will of God. And some day that's what everyone's diet will be! Hopefully more people will become be vegan whether Christians or not. We can bring the message of Jesus to vegans and bring the message of plant based diets to those who already believe.. Our church has a lot of veg or vegan folks. We serve vegan food every week. Sometimes we have special events about plant based diets and natural health for community outreach as well as member outreach. If you're ever near Los Angeles you're welcome to visit! Same goes to anyone else on these forums. You can message me if you want.

Josef

I am reasonably near Los Angeles, but with not driving, myself, it is not so conveniently near. I am by the county line to San Bernardino County. It sounds like you have a good church, better than a church I can attend that would have vegan food served at any event. Since the COVID distancing I just have not gone back to church.

I would still take messages and respond to them when I can.

I am sure there is God and I can trust Jesus, and my veganism is consistent with it, as things should be going to what is better. Do others have a right to not believe there is God? Sure they do, and they have a right to not listen and hear communication such as I might give that there is God. They don't have to and I would leave them alone. But if they would want to hear how I am sure there is God, I can really tell them about that.

Maybe there should be a forum where it can be discussed with acceptance of veganism in that.

 

[shyvas]

I am reasonably near Los Angeles, but with not driving, myself, it is not so conveniently near. I am by the county line to San Bernardino County.

That is also roughly the same area that I visit when I'm in CA.

 

[Noda]

When I was homeless I was rejected by every state run program at DSHS from EBT to Healthcare because I worked and was going to school. I told them I was literally starving (1 week without food) and while I was crying they literally handed me a list of churches. They tore up my applications in front of me and offered me condoms (I was celibate.) Churches would literally put toiletries and food on the hood of my car while I was sleeping in it. I figured out really fast who really cared about me.

I don't forget my life debts. The church kept me feed, clothed, let me sleep on church property, provided me showers and meals. Even the cultish denominations showed me nothing but grace.

See, I had to run away from home to save myself 20 sth years ago. No friends, no family, no support. No money. No home. For 2 years. I worked 2 jobs at the same time just to pay the rent for a room. Rooms were ratholes. I had barely enough money left to buy sanitary pads when needed and a loaf of bread and small butter. That is all I ate every week. 1 loaf of bread. 1 butter. For 2 years. Over 2 years. I couldn't afford any fruit or vegetables, rice, pasta,... I didn't have a warm cooked meal for over 2 years. I was starving. I was 40 pounds under my target weight. I was a skeleton. But...since I am not baptized no church helped me.

Last year I was in a real dire straits. I turned to church for help. Nothing.

Later the same year I experienced a great shock in my life. The past came crawling back. I couldn't stop crying. I went to church. For the first time in my life I attended a mass. The whole time tears were running down my cheeks. I was trying to hide them, but I ran out of tissues and I just cried. The church was full. Not a single person noticed. Not a single person offered support. I waited for the end of the mass. When everyone left, I spoke to the minister. For a few minutes. I told him I had nobody to turn to. I needed advice. He listen for a while. Then he had to leave because it was his dinner time. He did quickly bless me only after I said I would consider coming to classes for baptism for adults months later.


Regardless of that. I have tried many times to read the Bible after turning vegan.
Every single time I get so angry at God, Bible,... From the very start, God was the one who turned animals into what they are for people today. Worthless soulless, emotionless peaces of food. God was the first killer. He not only promoted killing animals, he caused Cain to kill Able. And then he put all the responsibility and blame on Cain and chased him away. God is almighty. God knows and sees everything. Why didn't he save Abel's life?

Ah, because Eve ate the forbidden apple. God is not a sane person!

If God exists he:
1. is not almighty at all and he lost control of what he created. He is weak. To cover that up he blames people's nature for all his failures. An, yes, the devil. Hmmm. Isn't he supposed to be stronger than devil? Since he created everything, didn't he create devil as well? Why would he do that? To punish a foolish young girl for taking an apple after he told her not to?!?! Come on!
He teaches forgiveness. Where is his?! According to his behavior, all parents of kids, especially teenagers should be allowed to kill or severely punish their kids the first time and every time they disobey. According to the human role model, the creator himself - God- parents should destroy their kids' lives and even punish further generations every time a child disobeys.

2.he is a mean, vindictive, childish, unreasonable, egotistical narcissistic being, which demands people not to be all he is and demands from them to be all he isn't - loving, straight forward, forgiving, sheltering, protective, good,... He behaves like a spoiled brat.

For everything that he does wrong or that we question about him, he found the perfect answer to shut us up: God works in mysterious ways.
Oh God, what a sad joke!


According to the original story:
Abel, a shepherd, offered the Lord the firstborns of his flock. Cain offered fruit and vegetables he had produced. The Lord respected Abel's sacrifice but did not respect that offered by Cain. In a jealous rage, Cain murdered Abel. Cain then became a fugitive.....
God-animal friendly????
God forgiving?
God a good role model?
God empathetic?
God vegan friendly?

Can you please explain how can anyone believe in God. And especially if one is a vegan. How can any sane intelligent ethical vegan believe in God? Please enlighten me. I must be missing something. I must be wrong about something.

Just turn on the world news. How does the father, the almighty and the righteous allow all that?
Because he gave people freedom to do whatever they want to do. What a bull ****! What a sadistic way to show he is powerless or maybe that is the proof that he doesn't exist.

In Serbia, a 13 year-old kid walks into a classroom and kills 9 of his classmates, a janitor and shoots a school teacher and more kids. He and all 9 kids were religious. Everyone was. Their parents as well.
I wonder what idiotic, intelligence insulting excuse for God one can find in this situation. Where was he? What was he doing? 9 of his believers and followers lost their lives for no reason at all. By their classmate who also comes from a religious family. Parents and siblings are crushed. Their lives will never be the same. Why didn't he protect his children, his followers?

Maybe the God is not the one churches and religions promote. The Bible was written by humans. The religions created by people. If you claimed today you talked to God or that he is your son's dad, you would be diagnosed psychotic, schizophrenic. Just over 2000years ago you became the respected law and rules maker and leader.


My definition of what a God should be like is : pure love, positive energy, pure forgiveness, protective, supporting, caring. Never threatning, never punishing.
True God - people would never be afraid of him. They would strive to be like him. At times of failure he would offer comfort and understanding.
No negative stuff.

The God church talks about is not vegan friendly. No animal and no human will ever find salvation in him or Jesus.

The God I described as my vision is vegan and animal friendly. Pure love.

To each their own. I would just love to find out how can a person be vegan and religious at the same time?

 

[Brian W]

To each their own. I would just love to find out how can a person be vegan and religious at the same time?

I am a christian and I experience no clash at all. Whatever the ins and outs of how and whether one understands and trusts the teachings in the Old Testament, God did not create suffering and will again create a world without suffering and I want to be there so I refuse to judge God's actions according to my own relatively small standards. I cannot understand as much as God understands and I would be arrogant to presume I do. Faith is about trust and if you want to know why I trust God, just look at Jesus. He even used the fact that God cares about animals to demonstrate how much he cares about us.

Human beings chose to live without God, not the other way around so it is arrogant and wrong to blame him for all the bad stuff that is happening. It is enough that he sent Jesus to bear our sins when he died that horrible death on the cross so that individually we can be saved. I'm sorry if you think that your plan would be better but I would rather trust the creator who understands how everything functions and relates.

You have a definition of God which is a god you made in your own image. You wouldn't say that you don't believe in a person if that person didn't totally agree with your beliefs, so why do it with God? It's quite arrogant to assume that the only god that could possibly exist is one who agrees entirely with you.

Whatever your reply, I won't get involved in this thread again. I have said my piece and these religion posts tend to attract anti-religious foot stomping and tend to go round in pointless circles, never leading anywhere.

I sincerely hope you find peace of mind because I don't believe you have done so yet. I wish you the best.

 

[g0rph]

See, I had to run away from home to save myself 20 sth years ago. No friends, no family, no support. No money. No home. For 2 years. I worked 2 jobs at the same time just to pay the rent for a room. Rooms were ratholes. I had barely enough money left to buy sanitary pads when needed and a loaf of bread and small butter. That is all I ate every week. 1 loaf of bread. 1 butter. For 2 years. Over 2 years. I couldn't afford any fruit or vegetables, rice, pasta,... I didn't have a warm cooked meal for over 2 years. I was starving. I was 40 pounds under my target weight. I was a skeleton. But...since I am not baptized no church helped me.

Last year I was in a real dire straits. I turned to church for help. Nothing.

Later the same year I experienced a great shock in my life. The past came crawling back. I couldn't stop crying. I went to church. For the first time in my life I attended a mass. The whole time tears were running down my cheeks. I was trying to hide them, but I ran out of tissues and I just cried. The church was full. Not a single person noticed. Not a single person offered support. I waited for the end of the mass. When everyone left, I spoke to the minister. For a few minutes. I told him I had nobody to turn to. I needed advice. He listen for a while. Then he had to leave because it was his dinner time. He did quickly bless me only after I said I would consider coming to classes for baptism for adults months later.


Regardless of that. I have tried many times to read the Bible after turning vegan.
Every single time I get so angry at God, Bible,... From the very start, God was the one who turned animals into what they are for people today. Worthless soulless, emotionless peaces of food. God was the first killer. He not only promoted killing animals, he caused Cain to kill Able. And then he put all the responsibility and blame on Cain and chased him away. God is almighty. God knows and sees everything. Why didn't he save Abel's life?

Ah, because Eve ate the forbidden apple. God is not a sane person!

If God exists he:
1. is not almighty at all and he lost control of what he created. He is weak. To cover that up he blames people's nature for all his failures. An, yes, the devil. Hmmm. Isn't he supposed to be stronger than devil? Since he created everything, didn't he create devil as well? Why would he do that? To punish a foolish young girl for taking an apple after he told her not to?!?! Come on!
He teaches forgiveness. Where is his?! According to his behavior, all parents of kids, especially teenagers should be allowed to kill or severely punish their kids the first time and every time they disobey. According to the human role model, the creator himself - God- parents should destroy their kids' lives and even punish further generations every time a child disobeys.

2.he is a mean, vindictive, childish, unreasonable, egotistical narcissistic being, which demands people not to be all he is and demands from them to be all he isn't - loving, straight forward, forgiving, sheltering, protective, good,... He behaves like a spoiled brat.

For everything that he does wrong or that we question about him, he found the perfect answer to shut us up: God works in mysterious ways.
Oh God, what a sad joke!


According to the original story:
Abel, a shepherd, offered the Lord the firstborns of his flock. Cain offered fruit and vegetables he had produced. The Lord respected Abel's sacrifice but did not respect that offered by Cain. In a jealous rage, Cain murdered Abel. Cain then became a fugitive.....
God-animal friendly????
God forgiving?
God a good role model?
God empathetic?
God vegan friendly?

Can you please explain how can anyone believe in God. And especially if one is a vegan. How can any sane intelligent ethical vegan believe in God? Please enlighten me. I must be missing something. I must be wrong about something.

Just turn on the world news. How does the father, the almighty and the righteous allow all that?
Because he gave people freedom to do whatever they want to do. What a bull ****! What a sadistic way to show he is powerless or maybe that is the proof that he doesn't exist.

In Serbia, a 13 year-old kid walks into a classroom and kills 9 of his classmates, a janitor and shoots a school teacher and more kids. He and all 9 kids were religious. Everyone was. Their parents as well.
I wonder what idiotic, intelligence insulting excuse for God one can find in this situation. Where was he? What was he doing? 9 of his believers and followers lost their lives for no reason at all. By their classmate who also comes from a religious family. Parents and siblings are crushed. Their lives will never be the same. Why didn't he protect his children, his followers?

Maybe the God is not the one churches and religions promote. The Bible was written by humans. The religions created by people. If you claimed today you talked to God or that he is your son's dad, you would be diagnosed psychotic, schizophrenic. Just over 2000years ago you became the respected law and rules maker and leader.


My definition of what a God should be like is : pure love, positive energy, pure forgiveness, protective, supporting, caring. Never threatning, never punishing.
True God - people would never be afraid of him. They would strive to be like him. At times of failure he would offer comfort and understanding.
No negative stuff.

The God church talks about is not vegan friendly. No animal and no human will ever find salvation in him or Jesus.

The God I described as my vision is vegan and animal friendly. Pure love.

To each their own. I would just love to find out how can a person be vegan and religious at the same time?

Veganism, for me, is the result of self-reflection, critical thinking and evidence.
All religions are the antithesis of that.

 

[beforewisdom]

The person who started this thread has not been on the site since May 30, 2021

 

[peacefulveglady]

I hope this thread gets closed as the OP not been here.
Its me being an ethical vegan has no connection to a God or religion. All religions are for control

 

[silva]

The person who started this thread has not been on the site since May 30, 2021

I hope this thread gets closed as the OP not been here.
Its me being an ethical vegan has no connection to a God or religion. All religions are for control

We have so many threads that are OP specific where OP never returns. They get resurrected every so often, why should this thread be treated any differently?

Honestly, while I'm agnostic it seems pretty crazy that anyone would believe in a good and just God and think it ok to slaughter without reason. Anyone believing in "design" should take into account our ability to be plant eaters. Eating animals seems like gluttony if you have options, and exploiting them for profit as greed--both clearly sins

 

[peacefulveglady]

We have so many threads that are OP specific where OP never returns. They get resurrected every so often, why should this thread be treated any differently?

Honestly, while I'm agnostic it seems pretty crazy that anyone would believe in a good and just God and think it ok to slaughter without reason. Anyone believing in "design" should take into account our ability to be plant eaters. Eating animals seems like gluttony if you have options, and exploiting them for profit as greed--both clearly sins

agreement

 

[majorbloodnok]

For me, making generalisations about religion is no more acceptable than making generalisations about veganism. Each person will make their own moral and ethical choices, hopefully but not always after considered thought. That is their right to do so.

As for a thread claiming there is "hope for vegans in Jesus", the implication is that there ISN'T any hope for vegans otherwise and that's a bastardisation of the bible whether one believes in Christian teaching or not. Why, when someone posts a view lacking balance, is it countered by people offering similarly unbalanced viewpoints from the opposite end of the spectrum? It doesn't have to be a simple case of "follow Christianity or you're damned" versus "all religions are total hogwash"; there are plenty of shades of grey between the two extremes. Why not combat unreasonable with reasonable instead? It works so much better.

Oh, and just before anyone asks I'm not going to get into any kind of religious debate for the same reasons I decided right at the beginning of my time with this forum not to try and debate meat consumption vs veganism.

 

[Brian W]

I just want to say one more thing. I think this thread was originally aimed at believers and anybody who is curious and not for debate or preaching at the uninterested. The uninterested, however, seemed to have some emotional reason to jump in and evangelically prove us wrong when we didn't ask for it. I haven't found a forum on the internet where I can safely discuss veganism and environmentalism from a christian perspective and I hoped this thread would have been the place but I was disappointed. What it has shown is how the cause of wars is not religion specifically, but corrupted human nature. Even so, I still have hope in humans when I hear about people, both religious and atheist, who lay down their lives to help others, both human and non-human, and my ultimate hope is in God's plan to restore all things. My belief is that he will, and not because I am gullible or stupid, but because I have spent my whole life thinking it through and exploring various spiritual beliefs until I received within myself all the certainty I need that the gospel of Jesus Christ is the way to eternal salvation. Of course I can't prove this to anybody, I can only discuss and debate and hope and pray, but debating with the uninterested is fruitless and I have to respect their choices because I respect them. I just wish that they would leave those of us who believe in something alone to have some kind of friendly interaction without having to evangelize their atheistic (or "spiritual") beliefs.
If I find the kind of forum I am looking for, I might not spend so much time here. I want to feel that my relationships are healthy and worthwhile.

 

[KLS52]

As a practicing Catholic, my religion/spirituality never came into play when I decided to become vegan. It's just not something I made a connection with at the time.

 

[Tom L.]

I just want to say one more thing. I think this thread was originally aimed at believers and anybody who is curious and not for debate or preaching at the uninterested. The uninterested, however, seemed to have some emotional reason to jump in and evangelically prove us wrong when we didn't ask for it. I haven't found a forum on the internet where I can safely discuss veganism and environmentalism from a christian perspective and I hoped this thread would have been the place but I was disappointed.

For the record, I'm agnostic, and pray regularly to the Creator. I've always thought your views and outlook come closer to mine than those of many vegetarians or vegans. This is a long thread with many viewpoints, but the passage I'm quoting below is from the first post in this thread:

To whoever has ears to hear, I am writing this so that you also may come to know Jesus the messiah and our creator in whom alone we may be raised up to life again. So that you may know God's love for us, and may have eternal life where you may see those you care about again. Your pets or family members or close friends. In this thread I hope to present the teachings of Jesus from the bible and especially address questions which members of the vegan community may have:
(bold emphasis mine)

I acknowledge that there is only one truth, as far as facts go (although I don't claim to know it as far as God is concerned). Not all beliefs are equally valid, and I don't necessarily believe that all religions are teaching the same thing (as some people have stated- although not in this thread). I just have a problem with the notion that those who do not know this truth are damned- or to put it another way, that only followers of one particular faith are saved. And the passage I quoted in italics from the first post in this thread clearly shows this attitude- unless perhaps Jesus also saves those who do not know/believe in Him yet. And it is clearly addressed to veg*n people who are not Christian.