Plastic

[Manatee]

This is like kill shelters taking years to become no-kills. There's no reason Kroger (or any other store) can't go plastic-free within months. And there's no reason a kill shelter can't go no-kill within a year or so. It's hard for me to celebrate these virtually empty commitments because damage and misery continue, unabated, for years while the PR machines make hay.

 

[MadamSarcastra]

This is like kill shelters taking years to become no-kills. There's no reason Kroger (or any other store) can't go plastic-free within months. And there's no reason a kill shelter can't go no-kill within a year or so. It's hard for me to celebrate these virtually empty commitments because damage and misery continue, unabated, for years while the PR machines make hay.

You know these things to be absolute facts? You may want to consider the region, as well... and how resistant some areas might be... for instance, I know mid-Michigan is a hell of a lot different than the coast of Florida. And have you directed your gripes at actual grocery stores & shelters, asked them why it takes them so long to transition??

I'd have to say, I think it would take a tad longer than a few months to convert nearly 2,800 stores to plastic-bag-free....

 

[Blues]

The government have banned single use plastic bags, to be phased out over the next year in NZ.

A strange product (plastic) use it once and it lasts a lifetime.

I feel confident alternative products will hit the market. Product development labs will be working overtime to develop new plastic whatever, it's going to be such a massive new market

 

[silva]

It's quite more complicated than simply not stocking plastic bags! This has been a highly contested argument. People will boycott stores, and protest, for having this convienence taken away! Same with plastic straws.
When I was a kid stores had paper bags, and at least in my neighborhood, most families folded them and stored to either reuse at stores or fill with newspapers for my schools recycle program.
We haven't had a Kroger store here since I was really little, they are in southern OH.
Aldi has been successful with no bags, and some stores offer small discounts for using your own bag.

It's beyond ridiculous to here people whine about their right to have bags provided! They're the same ilk as those who install the soot chimneys on their truck pipes

 

[MadamSarcastra]

They're the same ilk as those who install the soot chimneys on their truck pipes

Ughhh... those A-holes are everywhere around here.

 

[Manatee]

You know these things to be absolute facts?

Actually, yes. I was deeply involved in the transition of two shelters going from kill to no-kill and moderately involved with two others. I was active in the AR (AR not AW) movement for over three decades. I've done more AR work than I can even remember some days.

As for "absolute facts", it only takes a modicum of research and common sense to understand that it doesn't take seven years to stop using plastic bags.

You may want to consider the region, as well... and how resistant some areas might be... for instance, I know mid-Michigan is a hell of a lot different than the coast of Florida.

I've seen no evidence that "resistance" affects the discontinued use of plastics. Moreover, I'm not aware of protests or boycotts to keep plastic bags. If I've missed something, I'd appreciate links to news articles. I just did a quick search and found nothing. (And unless you've lived for some time here in Florida, don't be so sure that you know what it's like here.)

I don't think "resistance" should even be considered. People resist change all the time and once it's done (assuming it's good change), it's done, and people adjust to the new. If people love their plastic bags, then let them hoard them and reuse them in perpetuity.

And have you directed your gripes at actual grocery stores & shelters, asked them why it takes them so long to transition??

Plastic bags aren't an issue since no stores in my area are planning to do away with them. We do have an Aldi, but transitioning isn't an issue there. But, as I said, it takes only a modicum of common sense to know that it doesn't take seven years.

As for shelters... In my experience, I've never heard a reasonable or sensible answer when asked why they take several years to go from kill to no-kill. Money is often cited, but when presented with plans to better use their current budgets to shift from kill to no-kill, they just give non-answers, redirect the topic, or end communication.

 

[MadamSarcastra]

Actually, yes. I was deeply involved in the transition of two shelters going from kill to no-kill and moderately involved with two others. I was active in the AR (AR not AW) movement for over three decades. I've done more AR work than I can even remember some days.

As for "absolute facts", it only takes a modicum of research and common sense to understand that it doesn't take seven years to stop using plastic bags.



I've seen no evidence that "resistance" affects the discontinued use of plastics. Moreover, I'm not aware of protests or boycotts to keep plastic bags. If I've missed something, I'd appreciate links to news articles. I just did a quick search and found nothing. (And unless you've lived for some time here in Florida, don't be so sure that you know what it's like here.)

I don't think "resistance" should even be considered. People resist change all the time and once it's done (assuming it's good change), it's done, and people adjust to the new. If people love their plastic bags, then let them hoard them and reuse them in perpetuity.



Plastic bags aren't an issue since no stores in my area are planning to do away with them. We do have an Aldi, but transitioning isn't an issue there. But, as I said, it takes only a modicum of common sense to know that it doesn't take seven years.

As for shelters... In my experience, I've never heard a reasonable or sensible answer when asked why they take several years to go from kill to no-kill. Money is often cited, but when presented with plans to better use their current budgets to shift from kill to no-kill, they just give non-answers, redirect the topic, or end communication.

Well, I don't quite appreciate the thinly-veiled insults. I don't come here to be judged or bullied.

Bye-bye. I do hope you can find something to be happy about one day....

 

[silva]

So many good things are possible "in theory"

 

[Manatee]

Well, I don't quite appreciate the thinly-veiled insults. I don't come here to be judged or bullied.

Bye-bye. I do hope you can find something to be happy about one day....

I could say the same to you. But the real truth is that we make assumptions about what others mean when we only have the written word to go on, and that's nearly always a big error in judgment. As I responded to your comments to me, I initially thought you were being snotty and engaging in not-very-thinly-veiled insults. But then I remembered the truth: written words don't always carry tone, inflection, body language, etc. So I changed my thinking and then assumed you were simply engaging in discussion. It's too bad that you couldn't get to the same place.

And really, your last sentence is an old and very tired internet comment that goes back to the days of Usenet in the late 80s and early 90s. It says more about you than me, and it's a shame you feel you have to run away, because I think you're smart enough to engage in real discussion.

Btw, no one is or was judging or bullying you. Disagreement does not equate to negative judgment and certainly not to bullying. That you would make such an accusation is appalling. Again, it says more about you than me because I wrote nothing that was neither a negative judgment of you nor bullying you. I responded to your (dare I say it?) sarcastic finger-pointing questions as honestly and openly as I could. That you don't like my response is perfectly okay. I'm not at all offended or angered by disagreement. But don't accuse me of bullying you because that's not just preposterous, it's unequivocally untrue.

 

[MadamSarcastra]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1055379357626175488

 

[shyvas]

Can You Leave Plastic At The Till In Supermarkets? This Is What Could Happen If You Do – How To Use Less Plastic

 

[shyvas]

Deep Ocean Live: Plastic wrecks remote Indian Ocean turtle nesting island

No words - appalling, shameful. I'm worried that it's too late to save our wildlife.