This guy is Mitt Romney's running mate...

Weren't RATM and Led Zeppelin fairly anti-what he is? o_O

...and possibly Beethoven, but no idea.
 
K-II said:
Weren't RATM and Led Zeppelin fairly anti-what he is? o_O

...and possibly Beethoven, but no idea.
Click to expand...

Yeah, apparently he dedicated one of his symphonies to Napoleon Bonaparte, and then withdrew the dedication when Napoleon turned out to be a power-hungry war-loving monster. What did he expect? :p

In any case, regardless of the similarities between the Republicans and the Democrats, there are enough differences between the two parties and so I'd rather have the Democrats win. I would REALLY like the healthcare reforms (what little reform it is) to fully go into effect in 2014. I think it will (surprise!) actually help the average American citizen.
 
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Agreed. Anyone can point out the fact that big business and corporate executives have quite a bit of control in society - I don't think that's going to change any time soon, if ever. But from a social standpoint the Democrats are the better choice and will make more of a difference to one who views the world from even a relatively liberal standpoint.

And I firmly believe that a vote for an unpopular third party, while noble, is a vote wasted. I know that is unpopular here but it's truly what I think.
 
rainforests1 said:
The Democrats have created our empire, created our immigration policies that will cause so many problems,
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I think outsourcing labour to overseas countries, the super rich siphoning off everyone's money and enormous amounts of money funding pointless wars are of far more concern than the widely scapegoated immigrants. And that has been happening since Bush. Before Bush. But for some reason people blame Obama for an economic problem which already existed before he came into office.
 
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I don't get the Obama-blaming either. He's the President, not a miracle worker -which it would take to patch up the unsteady conditions we have going right now and have had going for a while now in 1-2 terms.
 
FortyTwo said:
And I firmly believe that a vote for an unpopular third party, while noble, is a vote wasted. I know that is unpopular here but it's truly what I think.
Click to expand...

All votes considered individually are almost completely worthless.
 
K-II said:
All votes considered individually are almost completely worthless.
Click to expand...

But a vote given to someone who literally has such a small chance of winning that they will not get elected, as opposed to a vote that will help elect the better one of the only two candidates that have a chance of winning? The first is more of a waste than the second and could easily contribute towards getting the worse candidate elected, all for the purpose of "making a statement" or "trying to change things". There are too many people voting for the main candidates, things will NOT change any time in the near future and wasting your vote isn't going to change anyone's mind.
 
Freesia said:
I think outsourcing labour to overseas countries, the super rich siphoning off everyone's money and enormous amounts of money funding pointless wars are of far more concern than the widely scapegoated immigrants. And that has been happening since Bush. Before Bush. But for some reason people blame Obama for an economic problem which already existed before he came into office.
Click to expand...
Actually given the resources Americans use, our population is far too high. We should have tried reducing our population decades ago. Losing farm land, water shortages, and peak oil are three potential problems. Neither party has even tried to address these problems. Millions(possibly tens of millions) may suffer. A much bigger problem than anything you mentioned. Immigration is a problem.

Syndicated columnist David Harsanyi claims Ryan's budget is wrong, but a lot less wrong than Obama's. Obama's would add $11 trillion to the debt over the next 10 years. He seems honest reading his past articles. Does anyone know anything about this?
 
rainforests1 said:
Actually given the resources Americans use, our population is far too high. We should have tried reducing our population decades ago. Losing farm land, water shortages, and peak oil are three potential problems. Neither party has even tried to address these problems. Millions(possibly tens of millions) may suffer. A much bigger problem than anything you mentioned. Immigration is a problem.

Syndicated columnist David Harsanyi claims Ryan's budget is wrong, but a lot less wrong than Obama's. Obama's would add $11 trillion to the debt over the next 10 years. He seems honest reading his past articles. Does anyone know anything about this?
Click to expand...
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/story/2012-05-18/federal-deficit-accounting/55179748/1
 
Opinions on Ryan:

Obama:


President Barack Obama, who repeatedly talks up the November election as a profound choice for the country, has rejected the Ryan approach as "thinly veiled social Darwinism".
The Democrat and former community organiser sees government as a place with enough resources to help the less fortunate.
The Ryan budget, Obama said in April, "is antithetical to our entire history as a land of opportunity and upward mobility for everybody who's willing to work for it; a place where prosperity doesn't trickle down from the top but grows outward from the heart of the middle class".
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Catholic Priests:


Ryan had said the budget is based on Catholic social teaching.

But in a letter, the Reverend Thomas J Reese called that nonsense.
"I am afraid that Chairman Ryan's budget reflects the values of his favourite philosopher Ayn Rand rather than the gospel of Jesus Christ," said Reese, a Jesuit priest and senior fellow at the Woodstock Theological Center at Georgetown University.
"Survival of the fittest may be OK for social Darwinists but not for followers of the gospel of compassion and love."
Click to expand...

Even Newt Gingrich isnt a fan...

Newt Gingrich, the former House speaker and one-time Republican presidential candidate, referred to Ryan's plan to overhaul Medicare as "right-wing social engineering". He later apologised.
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http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/7463754/Democrats-seize-upon-Ryan-choice
 
FortyTwo said:
But a vote given to someone who literally has such a small chance of winning that they will not get elected, as opposed to a vote that will help elect the better one of the only two candidates that have a chance of winning? The first is more of a waste than the second and could easily contribute towards getting the worse candidate elected, all for the purpose of "making a statement" or "trying to change things". There are too many people voting for the main candidates, things will NOT change any time in the near future and wasting your vote isn't going to change anyone's mind.
Click to expand...

I doubt your individual vote is likely to alter the outcome of that, either. And I'm pretty sure only votes for the worse candidate contribute anything toward getting them elected, even if there's a system for 'second preference' and so on, as long as you didn't put them next.
 
If voting actually made a difference, it would be illegal.
 
Spang said:
If voting actually made a difference, it would be illegal.
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Yessssss

In 2004, Ralph Nader got less than 1% of the total vote. All the liberals who might have voted for him were afraid to waste their votes on him. And Dubya still got reelected.
 
Amy SF said:
Yessssss

In 2004, Ralph Nader got less than 1% of the total vote. All the liberals who might have voted for him were afraid to waste their votes on him. And Dubya still got reelected.
Click to expand...

Even if every single liberal that could be persuaded to vote for him was, then the total vote percentage for Ralph Nader would probably have been somewhere around 3%, if not less.

Based on a rough estimate, of course. There's probably a way to calculate it but you'd need to know exactly how many liberals could be persuaded into voting for Ralph Nader.
 
Tom Morello: 'Paul Ryan Is the Embodiment of the Machine Our Music Rages Against'

Rage Against the Machine's guitarist blasts Romney's VP pick and unlikely Rage fan

Last week, Mitt Romney picked Paul Ryan, the Republican architect of Congress's radical right-wing budget plan, as his running mate. Ryan has previously cited Rage Against the Machine as one of his favorite bands. Rage guitarist Tom Morello responds in this exclusive op-ed.

Paul Ryan's love of Rage Against the Machine is amusing, because he is the embodiment of the machine that our music has been raging against for two decades. Charles Manson loved the Beatles but didn't understand them. Governor Chris Christie loves Bruce Springsteen but doesn't understand him. And Paul Ryan is clueless about his favorite band, Rage Against the Machine.

Ryan claims that he likes Rage's sound, but not the lyrics. Well, I don't care for Paul Ryan's sound or his lyrics. He can like whatever bands he wants, but his guiding vision of shifting revenue more radically to the one percent is antithetical to the message of Rage.

I wonder what Ryan's favorite Rage song is? Is it the one where we condemn the genocide of Native Americans? The one lambasting American imperialism? Our cover of "**** the Police"? Or is it the one where we call on the people to seize the means of production? So many excellent choices to jam out to at Young Republican meetings!

Don't mistake me, I clearly see that Ryan has a whole lotta "rage" in him: A rage against women, a rage against immigrants, a rage against workers, a rage against gays, a rage against the poor, a rage against the environment. Basically the only thing he's not raging against is the privileged elite he's groveling in front of for campaign contributions.

[...]
Click to expand...

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