Forcing Kids to be Vegan? | Parents Answer

[vegan89]

Parents force all kinds of things on children. (Church, religion, school, homework, chores, circumcision, etc.) The list goes on and on. Why are people so upset about vegan diets for kids but none of these other things?

 

[LoreD]

I really don't understand the controversy. The vegan, or plant based, diet is not something new. 9% of India is vegan, and has been for centuries. Their children don't seem to be negatively affected.

The Seventh Day Adventists have been raising their children on a vegan diet, and their children seem OK.

 

[Tom L.]

Parents force all kinds of things on children. (Church, religion, school, homework, chores, circumcision, etc.) The list goes on and on. Why are people so upset about vegan diets for kids but none of these other things?

I think it's because animal treatment issues aren't generally considered to be that important, compared to religion and education. Actually, I'll re-phrase that: animal treatment issues aren't generally considered to be that important, period.

 

[vegan89]

I think it's because animal treatment issues aren't generally considered to be that important, compared to religion and education. Actually, I'll re-phrase that: animal treatment issues aren't generally considered to be that important, period.

Well that's why people should be encouraged to watch movies like Dominion. Because watching stuff like that makes you feel uncomfortable with the animal suffering that is happening in the world and motivates you to make change.

People don't feel like it's important until they see it.

 

[KatKitoko]

Hi you guys, I'm new to the forum. I'm Kat, I'm a happy but isolated veg person. I seek some support today as a parent that didn't make this choice for their kids to be vegan as well.

We are in many ways a wonderful mixed family: different culture, language, religion, nationality and also food habits. Although I was convinced that I would never be with a person again who is a clear omnivore, when love hits there are higher powers a stake right
We have a beautiful open communication and accept the diversity in our little family and always know that love is our starting point, no matter what. That doesn't keep us form facing with some tough questions that don't have a comprise option. One of them is that my kids are not raised vegan. There are many reasons and I still stand by them or accept them today and I don't want to argue about it, that's not why I turned to this forum. I think it is up to every parent to see what makes sense and feels right for them and their kids in their situation.
But today, I saw my baby eating fish, my partner so lovingly shared their food with our 7 month son and I just couldn't cope, I burst into tears.
It just hit me hard to know in some ways, I am not understood in my own family. They know I don't eat meat / fish / dairy and my mother in law always makes sure she also prepares something vegan for me. But the basic sadness I feel to see my baby eating an animal, to serve him what I can only see as a piece of suffering won't be understood. A baby with such a beautiful healthy body, he seems so pure. But he is learning to digest and like the taste of animals. And of course there's the whole emotion mix up of feeling guilty (how can I know all this, being veg*n for more than 12 years myself and still being part of this cycle that continues? feeling silly for feeling guilty, feeling sad, etc)
So sorry for the long text entrance, I just wanted to vent and I think only a bunch of nice vegans can understand the issue.
Hope you are having a lovely day, wherever you are.

 

[Emma JC]

Hi you guys, I'm new to the forum. I'm Kat, I'm a happy but isolated veg person. I seek some support today as a parent that didn't make this choice for their kids to be vegan as well.

We are in many ways a wonderful mixed family: different culture, language, religion, nationality and also food habits. Although I was convinced that I would never be with a person again who is a clear omnivore, when love hits there are higher powers a stake right
We have a beautiful open communication and accept the diversity in our little family and always know that love is our starting point, no matter what. That doesn't keep us form facing with some tough questions that don't have a comprise option. One of them is that my kids are not raised vegan. There are many reasons and I still stand by them or accept them today and I don't want to argue about it, that's not why I turned to this forum. I think it is up to every parent to see what makes sense and feels right for them and their kids in their situation.
But today, I saw my baby eating fish, my partner so lovingly shared their food with our 7 month son and I just couldn't cope, I burst into tears.
It just hit me hard to know in some ways, I am not understood in my own family. They know I don't eat meat / fish / dairy and my mother in law always makes sure she also prepares something vegan for me. But the basic sadness I feel to see my baby eating an animal, to serve him what I can only see as a piece of suffering won't be understood. A baby with such a beautiful healthy body, he seems so pure. But he is learning to digest and like the taste of animals. And of course there's the whole emotion mix up of feeling guilty (how can I know all this, being veg*n for more than 12 years myself and still being part of this cycle that continues? feeling silly for feeling guilty, feeling sad, etc)
So sorry for the long text entrance, I just wanted to vent and I think only a bunch of nice vegans can understand the issue.
Hope you are having a lovely day, wherever you are.

welcome to the forum

big hugs for you and I hope you are able to work out a compromise - I can't imagine how painful this would be and I just try to remember that we also were brought up this way and yet we were able to choose differently...

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

 

[Tom L.]

Welcome, @KatKitoko ! I hope we can help you with this. I think most of us here were not raised veg, and many of us live with (or otherwise commonly associate with) people who eat meat.

 

[KatKitoko]

Thank you Tom and Emma for your response! I know these first years don't have to determine how they develop. Even if they eat these beings right now, there is somebody allready that doesn't right beside them. I wonder if they will judge me for the ( too strechted ) compromises I made. I guess I expect them to turn vegan later in life questioning why their vegan mother didn't start that way in the first place.
I have a habit of writing down things while they grow up and for some other tough aspects I wrote a letter to explain how we came to a decision. Not to defend them but just to show that at points in life you have to do with what you can at that time without knowing the outcome in the future. I will do the same for this problem I guess. I'll also have a conversation with my partner about my boundaries and expectations when we would move to Europe again: when food options are different and a varied and healthy diet for kids is possible, the menu for them cannot stay the same.
And in the end it is true, I also grew up loving animal based products and several ex-vegetarians around me warned me: if you will live in rural Africa you will put meat back on the menu. After more than 5 years and during two pregnancies this was never te case for me. I will trust the journey of my kids as well.
That doesn't take away that it is difficult along the way sometimes, pfiieuw! Thanks a gain for your kind words, the situation was even harder because I realised that my way of thinking wasn't shared with anybody in miles around me.

 

[Col]

I do cook vegan food for my children half the week.
it is nice your family discusses it and writes it down, that will mean a lot I think.
I am a co-parent (which is regarded as perfectly normal and ethical in my society),
so doing this gives them a balanced and more ethical diet which
is available locally and nicer for me to cook and clean.
They will have an informed choice in any case, they choose when out or are given food.

 

[majorbloodnok]

This might be a bit lateral for a while, so bear with me on this...

Ever since the baby milk scandal in 1977, I have been part of the Nestlé boycott. Given the extent of their market reach, it is at times somewhat awkward but I believe it's the ethical thing for me to do to protect vulnerable babies and their parents. As a result, I won't buy any Nestlé products and that means, since I do most of the shopping, that my family don't get to consume Nestlé products either. They are fully aware of my stance and understand my reasons for it. This also means de facto that my kids have been raised as Nestlé boycotters as well.

All that said, I have never put any pressure on them to adopt my ethical stance. My wife agrees with my principles in general but doesn't feel as strongly, being more of the opinion that 46 years is perhaps a bit too long to not move on. As a result, there are times when she will buy a Nestlé-related chocolate bar or similar and give it to one or other of them as a treat. Moreover, now both my kids are old enough to earn their own money they are free to spend it on Nestlé products if they see fit; it's not my business. As it happens, they rarely do since the ethics and morality I have shown by example to them over the years makes sense to them and they broadly follow the same path.

Now, with the above (entirely true) story, substitute the term "Nestlé" with "meat" and you have my view on raising a child on a vegan diet and respecting vegan ethics. My and my wife's kids are our responsibility, but they are not our property. They are free to choose what they want to consume but they are not free to dictate what I provide for them - neglect of parental duties aside. I am not free to dictate what my wife gives them as long as once again it is not a neglect of parental duties, but given we are a married couple I would expect her to show due respect for my strongly held views as much as she has a right to expect I show respect for hers - that's the art of compromise that has helped us stay married for the last 25 years.

If anyone outside the family were to take me to task for refusing to buy Nestlé chocolate for my kids on the grounds of it being "cruel" or "unfair", that person would get a very short answer with an "off" in it. As long as we are meeting their dietary, social and emotional needs in other ways it's no-one else's business what we provide our kids with.

I hope the parallels are clear. I just feel the arguments around raising kids are too loaded when veganism as a topic is included, but stepping back and looking at it as just one of any number of ethical stances makes it easier to demonstrate what is and is not appropriate. In short, my feeling is that as long as a child is well cared for and loved, and is given the freedom as it grows to take control of its own life and choices, any external interference is unwarranted.

 

[VeganRachel]

All the people around me are different. I am the only normal person.

Normal for being awake, compassionate and caring. Thank you.

 

[VeganRachel]

Are omnivore parents "forcing their children" to eat meat? Are they "brainwashing" their children? If I had been brought up on a vegan diet I wouldn't have found it so difficult to make the choice when I became an adult.

Agreed, Omnivorsim is so "normal" in the world it is ASSumed that it is healthy, normal, and acceptable.
However what parents are unconsciously doing is teaching their children that violence is okay and you
can eat it. It also begins a cycle of disease and unhealthiness, leading to heart disease, cancers, diabetes,
cholesterol problems and more. Look at Nimai Delgado, raised vegetarian since birth and vegan for many years. He has never
been 'deficient" in animal flesh, nor does he crave (addiction) what he has never eaten.

 

[majorbloodnok]

Agreed, Omnivorsim is so "normal" in the world it is ASSumed that it is healthy, normal, and acceptable.

Not sure why you put the word “normal” in quotes. It is the dietary regime followed by the majority of people globally, so it is by definition normal.

Moreover, none of the subsequent attributes you listed are assumptions. It is de facto acceptable (since it is normal) and there is centuries-worth of evidence to demonstrate an omnivorous diet such as we have evolved to consume is no less healthy than any other.

I should qualify that, however. Firstly, whilst such a diet is by definition acceptable, that does not mean it is universally acceptable. The growing number of people finding it unacceptable demonstrates that and may yet change the majority opinion in time.

I should also say that whilst there is nothing inherently unhealthy with an omnivorous diet per se, there is overwhelming evidence that any unbalanced diet can be significantly unhealthy and in particular any with the kind of preponderance of animal products we see as normal in modern first-world countries is factually unhealthy. As a society we have a very skewed idea of what is (in health terms) an appropriate amount of meat in a balanced and healthy diet irrespective of any ethical considerations.

It is important, therefore, to recognise that life is not as simple as omnivorous = unhealthy, plant-based = healthy. It is possible to follow good and bad examples of each. That said, if someone were to switch from the typical omnivorous diet to the typical vegan one, the chances are their health and long-term medical prospects would improve.

 

[VeganRachel]

Raising kids vegan is brainwashing, right? Vegan parents force THEIR beliefs on their children and severely limiting their choices. With all the nutrition concerns of vegan diets and the social difficulties faced by kids seen as “different,” is it fair, or even safe, to raise kids vegan? In this interview video, hear real vegan parents respond to these concerns! See the links in the video description on YouTube for further resources!

Like almost all of us, I was raised as an omnivore by myt parents who never offered me a choice. I do not blame them as they did the best they could.
However, if they had known and told me the truth about how animals were treated, i would have made the vegan choice much earlier. When vegan
parents are told they are forcing their children or brainwashing their kids to go vegan, the issue of billions of humans raising their kids as omnivores
is completely overlooked. Omnivorsim, the exploitation of animals, is normalized and excused.

 

[majorbloodnok]

Like almost all of us, I was raised as an omnivore by myt parents who never offered me a choice. I do not blame them as they did the best they could.
However, if they had known and told me the truth about how animals were treated, i would have made the vegan choice much earlier. When vegan
parents are told they are forcing their children or brainwashing their kids to go vegan, the issue of billions of humans raising their kids as omnivores
is completely overlooked. Omnivorsim, the exploitation of animals, is normalized and excused.

Your comment about “offered you a choice” is key. I personally have never heard firsthand anyone telling a vegan parent they are brainwashing their child, but for it to be valid the element of freedom to choose must be absent. The kicker, of course, is that if a child cannot choose to start adopting a vegan stance the accusation must be applied the other way round. What you have outlined is one of many logical inconsistencies in arguments employed by people not taking the effort to think things through.

 

[Brian W]

Moreover, none of the subsequent attributes you listed are assumptions. It is de facto acceptable (since it is normal)

Are you not confusing acceptable with accepted? Surely what is acceptable is not dependent upon what is normal otherwise individual traits could be considered unacceptable. In most European countries for example, we would have to conclude that people with white skin are acceptable, purely because they have white skin. There are areas of the world wherein the domination of women by men is still normal. Does that make it acceptable?

 

[majorbloodnok]

Are you not confusing acceptable with accepted? Surely what is acceptable is not dependent upon what is normal otherwise individual traits could be considered unacceptable. In most European countries for example, we would have to conclude that people with white skin are acceptable, purely because they have white skin. There are areas of the world wherein the domination of women by men is still normal. Does that make it acceptable?

Interesting point, but no. I'm using the term "acceptable" in the truest sense.

What is acceptable can be answered on two levels; as an individual and as a society. As I also said in my earlier post, "acceptable" doesn't have to mean "universally acceptable", so how an individual judges acceptability can easily differ from the view of the society in which they live. Nonetheless, what a society deems acceptable is basically determined by the majority view.

As a result, in your first example, the important detail is whether or not the majority view is that skin colour is significant or not, not what the skin colour actually is. If the majority view and the normal standpoint is that all people are equal irrespective of skin colour, any racist overtones will be judged unacceptable. Sadly, if the majority feel skin colour is important, racism may well be an acceptable stance within that society.

Of course, in your second example you showed how things can get muddied up a bit with regard to whose views in that society actually count towards that majority opinion. Clearly, the stance of women in some societies is deemed irrelevant and so what is acceptable is determined by a male subset. Even so, within that society it seems some very sexist behaviour is deemed acceptable. That said, in this age of global relations, such societies cannot exist in their own bubbles and they increasingly have to take into account the views of the wider community within which they exist - the global society if you will. At that point, the local majority becomes a global minority and what is deemed acceptable locally is no longer acceptable in the wider context. The country comes, therefore, under pressure to change its stance and if it doesn't it risks being marginalised and isolated.

So is it acceptable for women to be dominated by men? My individual view is no. The view of (for example) Iraqi society is yes. The international view is the same as mine - no.

As for consumption of meat, I doubt you would find it acceptable. However, internationally the majority view is that it is perfectly acceptable. That doesn't mean the majority view globally won't change, and if or when it does then meat consumption will legitimately be deemed unacceptable.

Sorry for the long-winded explanation, but what is and what should be acceptable are not the same thing and getting the two straight is an important step in changing attitudes. In my opinion, of course.