Health Issues The Everything Covid 19 Thread

[David3]

The fundamental flaw that makes all authoritarian argument irrelevant is that they assume that rulers will be completely altruistic and only do what's best for the people, this assumption is fundamentally untrue, rulers will be self serving, there's a reason why every dictator in history has done things for their own gain at the people's expense, in fact all governments are self serving that's why we need to limit government power.

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No. Less talking, more action. Get over to Florida. Help care for those hospitalized people who have spread/contracted COVID due to their refusal to get vaccinated. Support your convictions. Action talks, bullsh*t walks.

 

[anarchist100]

To those opposed to covid mandates, whether the mask or vaccine- @anarchist100
If you live in an apartment and you get a new neighbor you soon find is creating a hoard. You soon begin to find the smells of garbage are wafting into the hallways,then you start smelling it in your own home. You confront them and they tell you to worry about yourself and leave them alone.You're clean, you do everything you can to prevent bugs but now you find bedbugs and cockroaches. Your neighbor declares they have a right to how they live, and you can get an exterminator or whatever you want to do.
Where I live at least, this neighbor would be subject to an inspection by city officials and given a time frame to get there housing cleaned and the infestation addressed or risk being evicted

Do you believe this is a violation of their rights?
How is this different than the unvaccinated causing the resurgance of covid and the rise in mutations that otherwise would be stopped if everyone were vaccinated? Is it far to those who have complied and received the vaccine to have to deal with the threat of covid variants and the consequences?

In this situation I concede that it would not be wrong for someone to do something about the hoarder, as what he's doing is violating someone else's property rights. I don't think this is the same as mask and vaccine mandates though, no one is forcing you to associate with an unvaccinated person.

 

[beancounter]

Opinion | I Was the Architect of Operation Warp Speed. I Have a Message for All Americans. (Published 2021)

I oversaw the vaccines. They are safe, and they work.

www.nytimes.com

 

[silva]

In this situation I concede that it would not be wrong for someone to do something about the hoarder, as what he's doing is violating someone else's property rights. I don't think this is the same as mask and vaccine mandates though, no one is forcing you to associate with an unvaccinated person.

it's a scientific fact that viruses left to spread, as in, unvaccinated, unmasked, unregulated populations, will mutate into stronger viruses.

How Viral Mutations Occur in SARS-CoV-2

In this video, Yale experts discuss how viral mutations occur.

www.yalemedicine.org

If you can understand that a neighbor unwilling to prevent insect infestation is infringing on others, how do you not understand that not preventing the spread of viral mutations is not infringing on the rights of others? You obviously believe in property rights--how about the rights of those with businesses? How about workers rights?
Seems to me your logic would demand proof of vaccination/masking as those are the people who activily participate and promote the free enterprise system

 

[anarchist100]

it's a scientific fact that viruses left to spread, as in, unvaccinated, unmasked, unregulated populations, will mutate into stronger viruses.

How Viral Mutations Occur in SARS-CoV-2

In this video, Yale experts discuss how viral mutations occur.

www.yalemedicine.org

If you can understand that a neighbor unwilling to prevent insect infestation is infringing on others, how do you not understand that not preventing the spread of viral mutations is not infringing on the rights of others?

If you're worried than just avoid the unvaccinated.

You obviously believe in property rights--how about the rights of those with businesses? How about workers rights?
Seems to me your logic would demand proof of vaccination/masking as those are the people who activily participate and promote the free enterprise system

They should be allowed to, I think it's immoral but it's their business, although I don't think the government should be forcing them to do it.

I have a question for you, what gives the government the right to make decisions about other people's lives in the first place? Who gave them this authority? They're just normal people like you and me, what gives them these rights? what gives them a higher claim over a person's life than that person?

 

[David3]

If you're worried than just avoid the unvaccinated.

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Because you don't have a job, you have the luxury of avoiding the unvaccinated. You're talking like an elitist.

How about people who work as waiters in restaurants? They work indoors, all day, surrounded by customers who may or may not be vaccinated. Why don't you go tell them, right now, that they should just avoid the unvaccinated! Tell them to quit their jobs, and that you'll support them instead - pay up! Or, you can volunteer to find them a job that doesn't require associating with the public - get busy!

 

[David3]

I have a question for you, what gives the government the right to make decisions about other people's lives in the first place? Who gave them this authority? They're just normal people like you and me, what gives them these rights? what gives them a higher claim over a person's life than that person?

When your rights infringe on the safety of others, it's a problem.

In California, people aren't allowed to smoke in indoor restaurants and businesses. There's a good reason for this - the privilege of smoking indoors creates a secondhand-smoke health risk to others. Other people matter, not just you.
.

 

[anarchist100]

When your rights infringe on the safety of others, it's a problem.

In California, people aren't allowed to smoke in indoor restaurants and businesses. There's a good reason for this - the privilege of smoking indoors creates a secondhand-smoke health risk to others. Other people matter, not just you.
.

Business owners can decide for themselves whether they want people to smoke in their store, they don't need the government to do it for them.

 

[David3]

Business owners can decide for themselves whether they want people to smoke in their store, they don't need the government to do it for them.

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Employees don't have always the option of choosing where they work. And, they are the ones who breathe in all that secondhand smoke.
.

 

[Lou]

The fundamental flaw that makes all authoritarian argument irrelevant is that they assume that rulers will be completely altruistic and only do what's best for the people, this assumption is fundamentally untrue, rulers will be self serving, there's a reason why every dictator in history has done things for their own gain at the people's expense, in fact all governments are self serving that's why we need to limit government power.

Um. not to get this thread completely off track but in the strictest sense Communism is an economic system. Not a system of government.
for instance and Israeli Kibutz works on Communist principals.
and there are many example of capitalist systems that are autocratic. (like the State of Texas).

Communism and Capitalism are not bad by definition.
Although neither is Democratic or autocratic systems.
Its mostly in the application.

 

[anarchist100]

Um. not to get this thread completely off track but in the strictest sense Communism is an economic system. Not a system of government.
for instance and Israeli Kibutz works on Communist principals.
and there are many example of capitalist systems that are autocratic. (like the State of Texas).

Communism and Capitalism are not bad by definition.
Although neither is Democratic or autocratic systems.
Its mostly in the application.

The post was a criticism of state communism, my point is that even if individual rights must yield to the common good, the government is not fit to decide this, as government is self serving.

 

[anarchist100]

A right that can be taken away and given back is not a right.

 

[beancounter]

And back on topic..

The poster child for Free.dumb

Texas GOP Official H. Scott Apley Mocked COVID Days Before He Died of Virus

H. Scott Apley’s Facebook page was filled with anti-mask, anti-vaccine content until he was suddenly hospitalized on Sunday.

www.thedailybeast.com

 

[Lou]

OMG!!

I just heard that the government is requiring an Age Passport to enter a bar or buy liquor.
AND a Driving Passport to operate a motor vehicle.

 

[Lou]

Can't decide if this is good news or bad news.

Anti-vaxxers pretend to be vegan to avoid having the COVID-19 vaccine

As people fake that they are 'ethical vegans' to avoid the COVID-19 vaccine, animal rights activists say everyone eligible should get vaccinated.

www.euronews.com

 

[Mufflon]

Interestingly enough I don't notice that much discussion about not-getting-the-shot because of being a vegan in Germany (maybe I'm not in the right sphere though, dunno).

Most people are going on about "the stuff's not being tested enough yet" and fear long term consequences of the vaccine. Interestingly enough they don't seem to fear long-COVID damage (maybe because they thing they're still young/it's just like the flu/they're immune superhumans/whatever).

 

[silva]

Here's another qualifier for the Free.Dumb meddle--

NPR Cookie Consent and Choices

 

[anarchist100]

OMG!!

I just heard that the government is requiring an Age Passport to enter a bar or buy liquor.
AND a Driving Passport to operate a motor vehicle.

I'm opposed to those too, I agree with you that a vaccine passport is a lot like these things, however I see them as also tyrannical.

 

[Lou]

^ Saw this today and it made me think of you.

Liberty is never free - there is always a cost.
Rights come with responsibility.

 

[Mufflon]

Rights come with responsibility.

So much this.