News 2016 U.S. Presidential election - the highs and lows

Spang said:
It's only day one, man.

I'm optimistic, maybe a little too optimistic, that a Trump presidency will motivate people to organize; to resist and rebel; to do more than just vote for the lesser, neoliberalism-as-usual, evil every four years.
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I hope you're right, I truly do.

I think that the chance that you are is somewhere south of 1% though.

I guess we'll see in two years, and then again two years after that. Of course, in a few months, we'll have a conservative Supreme Court, and within the next few years, we'll almost certainly have a heavily conservative-packed Supreme Court. That will change things beyond repair for a generation or more.
 
As a follow up to my last post - I think very few people really understand the power of the Supreme Court to change things for many decades.

Ginsberg is 83, Breyer is 78, and both are in poor health. Kennedy, the centrist, is 80.
 
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"A more just, anti-racist, pro-feminist, queer-friendly, and less ecologically destructive future will not appear after the right justices hear the right lawyers make the right arguments. Liberals should realize this by now. By fixating on the Supreme Court, they have inherited the framers’ skepticism of popular sovereignty, of mass politics, and of the exercise of public power. They have adopted a view of constitutional politics that revolves around ideas of procedure, consensus, and finality." --Rob Hunter
 
"The threat of fascism is real. To turn the tide, the left needs a strategy to transform popular outrage into a potent challenge to the capitalist system." --Ben Reynolds
 
Amy SF said:
It's Brexit all over again.
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I can't remember if I did on VV (I'm sure I must have) but I know I did mention this at least 100 times in the run up to the election.:D

Capstan said:
There is an enormous mistrust of Hillary Clinton in this country. Many see her as the leader of a crime syndicate. Factor in especially that she's been promising to place the United States on a direct war-footing with Russia- conceivably nuclear war- and it's not surprising people turned away from her. I think many who voted for Trump don't necessarily share his cultural prejudices, but merely saw him as the lesser of the two evils. Trump may talk nasty, but he's yet to have been put to the test; meanwhile, Clinton has a proven record of dangerous activity. It may be, her foreign policy posture was the deciding factor in her loss.
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I have read that some people think Hillary Clinton is some type of criminal mastermind.:rolleyes: I just saw a man on TV (from New York Magazine, I think) and he was saying that he thought HC was the symbol of everything people hated about the establishment and thought that she was a terrible candidate to have.
 
I'll read the Michael Moore article when I have more time.

I know this is one dimensional but I'm worried what this will do for healthcare. Clinton wanted to move to single payer. I had a hope to semi-retire soon working part time. I've even been looking into a job but it's part time. Will I have to say no thanks if they are interested in hiring. Age a disadvantage. But with no insurance. I don't know how I can do my job full time to 62. It's already killing me and I'm in my mid 50's.
 
Spang said:
"A more just, anti-racist, pro-feminist, queer-friendly, and less ecologically destructive future will not appear after the right justices hear the right lawyers make the right arguments. Liberals should realize this by now. By fixating on the Supreme Court, they have inherited the framers’ skepticism of popular sovereignty, of mass politics, and of the exercise of public power. They have adopted a view of constitutional politics that revolves around ideas of procedure, consensus, and finality." --Rob Hunter
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What does that even mean?!

The guy apparently has no idea about the structure of the U.S government.
 
Spang said:
It's only day one, man.

I'm optimistic, maybe a little too optimistic, that a Trump presidency will motivate people to organize; to resist and rebel; to do more than just vote for the lesser, neoliberalism-as-usual, evil every four years.
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I am so hoping this will happen. I, for one, am going to do my part.
 
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Good for you, PTree.

As for me, I've been banging my head against the wall for too long. I don't have anything left. I'll vote, but that's probably going to be the extent of it.

I already changed my homepage away from my normal news feed. Basically, I'm disengaging and concentrating on taking care of the animals in my care, which is the only way I can make a difference that matters to me.
 
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Who knows, perhaps the out-of-control Trumpster-fire will go to prison for tax-evasion and/or sexual assault.... I can be hopeful about that, right?? :shrug: (crosses fingers)
 
Mischief said:
As the saying goes, people get the leaders they deserve. Unfortunately, the rest of us are along for the ride.

Now we'll see just exactly how much damage can be done.

For myself, I'm holding every single person who helped get him elected responsible. That includes everyone who voted or him, everyone who didn't vote, and everyone who threw their votes away. That includes every one of the third party voters.
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So we owe it to you to vote your way? Sounds like you belong in one of those countries where if you don't vote for the "right" candidate, you can be jailed or killed. By the way, libertarian candidates tend to pull from republicans and green party from the democrats. Many, many newcomers to the Gary Johnson FB pages were republicans not happy with Trump. They were never going to vote for Hillary.

I'll say what I said last spring during the primaries. Bernie would have beaten Trump. And I'm not a Bernie fan so it's not sour grapes. The DNC tried to shove Hillary down voters' throats and even admitted to some vote rigging. Blame them. Or continue to blame and the rest of the Johnson voters, we don't care. Even if Johnson wasn't on the ballot, I wouldn't have voted for Hillary. Or Trump for that matter.

I get being upset your candidate didn't win. I do not get those who think they have the right to command everyone vote their way.
 
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Spang said:
It seems pretty clear to me.


Did you read the entire article or just the part I quoted?
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I read the entire article. It's remarkably silly. It assumes that the entire U.S. government can be re-worked into a leftist ideal.

Speaking as a liberal, I don't expect SCOTUS to implement the changes I would !ike to see. I hope that SCOTUS will stay out of the way of such changes. That's only possible with a nonconservative SCOTUS. Let's say that at some point, in god knows how distant a future, liberals or even leftists control Congress and the Presidency. A conservative SCOTUS, which will outlast the Trump presidency and the GOP Congress by many decades, will put the brakes on any such liberal/leftist legislative agenda.
to ponder
That's reality.

ETA: It's not my intention to sound harsh toward you, Spang. I think you're a really good guy, with a good heart. I also enjoy reading your posts. They always give me something to ponder, even when I end up disagreeing.
 
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Wolfie said:
So we owe it to you to vote your way? Sounds like you belong in one of those countries where if you don't vote for the "right" candidate, you can be jailed or killed. By the way, libertarian candidates tend to pull from republicans and green party from the democrats. Many, many newcomers to the Gary Johnson FB pages were republicans not happy with Trump. They were never going to vote for Hillary.

I'll say what I said last spring during the primaries. Bernie would have beaten Trump. And I'm not a Bernie fan so it's not sour grapes. The DNC tried to shove Hillary down voters' throats and even admitted to some vote rigging. Blame them. Or continue to blame and the rest of the Johnson voters, we don't care. Even if Johnson wasn't on the ballot, I wouldn't have voted for Hillary. Or Trump for that matter.

I get being upset your candidate didn't win. I do not get those who think they have the right to command everyone vote their way.
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No, you don't owe it to me to vote my way.

I do think that everyone owed it to basic decency to try to stop Trump.

But I have learned that basic decency is not highly rated by about half of my fellow citizens.
 
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