Animal Rights are oysters the new honey?

[Freesia]

Anyone who has a cat will know about the filthy look. Actually though Gypsy doesnt really do that, she just looks dismissive in these situations. She is too docile to do those kinds of looks.

 

[prioritarian]

So apparently now feeding cats meat brings your status as a vegan into question, but oysters are a grey area.
Quite the revelation, if I do say so myself.

First of all, I never said it called my non-vegan status in question. I'm completely comfortable with the idea that it's not possible to be a perfect vegan. Secondly, when I feed my cat dead animal flesh I feel *some* empathy for the animals that were killed (but obviously not enough to stop doing this). Call me crazy but I think empathy is a good thing.

They demand feeding and you cant exactly give them lightly sauted kale, and mushrooms stuffed with herbs and shallots. They will give you a really filthy look and walk off.

Do you ever think about what you feed them?

 

[Danielle]

I dont understand what else you can feed a cat. They demand feeding and you cant exactly give them lightly sauted kale, and mushrooms stuffed with herbs and shallots. They will give you a really filthy look and walk off.

they do make vegan cat food fortified with vitamins including taurine. There's different brands, Ami seems to be the most popular

 

[Freesia]

I know they do, but I dont believe that cats can be vegan. Dogs perhaps, rats yes. Cats, no.

 

[Danielle]

I believe they can, if the cat food has all the right nutrients. As long as they eat it..
I mean, there's no fortified vegan cat food in the wild so in the wild yes they do need meat.

 

[Freesia]

But it is risky and I dont want to put my cat under that kind of risk.

 

[FortyTwo]

It is incredibly risky and should not be attempted by anyone who...

Actually, it just should not be attempted by anyone, ever, until we develop the right nutritional mixes (which we definitely do not have right now, not in a satisfactorily safe way).

Too many stories of cats dying because of their neglectful owners attempting to feed them a kinder diet.

We are omnivores. We can choose to not eat meat. Cats are obligate carnivores, they do not have that privilege. Feed them what they need to eat. If you have an ethical gripe (and it is perfectly understandable that you would, the meat industry is awful, that's why we're all here, aren't we?) to the point that you can't bring yourself to feed your cats meat, you should not have cats.

If you have a pet, you should know how to take care of it and be able to do so, rather than try to misguidedly force your own morals from your own human perspective on it.

 

[Calliegirl]

Like it or not, cats are carnivores, and to feed them only plants is cruel. There are millions of meat eating cats who live to be 15+, even 20+ years old. I have yet to hear of any plant eating cats living even close to that life span. It's selfish to force your morality on another animal and feed them something unnatural, because it 'bothers you' to feed them their correct diet. As stated above, if this is the case, then don't have one. There aren't any laws requiring you to have a cat. There are plenty of bunnies, birds and farm animals looking for homes though.

I've also heard the argument that you are causing the death of other animals by feeding them meat. NOT TRUE. Cat and dog food is made of by-products of animals who were already killed to feed omnivores.

 

[prioritarian]

I've also heard the argument that you are causing the death of other animals by feeding them meat. NOT TRUE. Cat and dog food is made of by-products of animals who were already killed to feed omnivores.

Slaughter houses earn hundreds of millions of dollars a year processing farm animals and household pets into rendered pet food ingredients. Moreover, much of this industry occurs in hellishly unregulated environments. I personally do not believe there is any ethical difference between purchasing a pink slime burger and purchasing 9 lives kibble.

And to bring this back to the original post: My decision to feed the 17 year-old cats I live with dead animals is something that really sickens me and makes it *IMPOSSIBLE* for me to definitively claim that I am "more vegan" that Diana Fleischman (ex co-host of thttp://theveganoption.org/2013/01/30/farewell-diana/).

Heck, I personally find the consumption of shiny organic fruit to be a larger ethical issue than oyster consumption:

If we say that the world produces maybe 20,000 tons of shellac per year (assume metric tons, i.e., 1000 kg), and each requires 50,000 insects to produce, that's a total of 1 trillion insects per year.
Why I Don't Support Eating Insects
​

 

[FortyTwo]

Of course cat food isn't ethically sound. Neither is having cats in the first place.

But there are cats, and they need to be fed.

So...

 

[Calliegirl]

Of course cat food isn't ethically sound. Neither is having cats in the first place.

But there are cats, and they need to be fed.

So...

Exactly.
A situation we caused to happen in the first place, so it's our responsibility to care for them.

 

[Second Summer]

So for those who are proper utilitarians, who above all else want to minimize suffering, is the correct thing to do to euthanize any cats in your care so that all those creatures can avoid death as cat food? Should meat-eating people in your family be euthanized as well? Think of all the animals spared of suffering!

 

[ledboots]

Maybe feed the cat oysters? With honey?

 

[prioritarian]

Maybe feed the cat oysters? With honey?

Skeptical vegan proposed that we use oysters for pet food. I think this is a very good idea.

Vegan Cats? | Skeptical Vegan

 

[prioritarian]

So for those who are proper utilitarians, who above all else want to minimize suffering, is the correct thing to do to euthanize any cats in your care so that all those creatures can avoid death as cat food?

Killing healthy animals is not euthanasia. I believe we vegans should be clamoring for the development of palatable vegan cat food that is independently cerified to meet or exceed AAFCO standards. I'd trade all the "beyond meat" in the world for "beyond cat food".

 

[Calliegirl]

Killing healthy animals is not euthanasia. I believe we vegans should be clamoring for the development of palatable vegan cat food that is independently cerified to meet or exceed AAFCO standards. I'd trade all the "beyond meat" in the world for "beyond cat food".

Something that can be done right now to lessen the dependency on meat for pets, is to go out and promote spaying and neutering. That's something that all of us can do, we all need to stop complaining and DO SOMETHING.

Less puppies and kittens being born = less meat needed to feed them. Rather than putting band-aids on the problem by inventing an artificial food and killing the thousands of puppies and kittens in shelters, we need to focus on and fix the problem at it's roots.

We need more legislation that requires all animals to be fixed, and breeders who are usually exempt to have very strict rules, including being taxed as a business, regular inspections they must pay for, require all animals they sell to be fixed before leaving as well as have all shots and a vet visit, and have to buy an expensive permit. Huge fines/jail time for backyard breeders who don't follow the rules. Hopefully, that will dissuade most people from breeding. We also need to stop animal sales in pet shops and only allow low cost adoptions, and make low cost or free spay and neutering available to everyone.

This is not impossible to do, getting information out is the key. There are communities out there where the local government worked with it's citizens and animal groups and they made a huge dent in their overpopulation problem.

 

[Calliegirl]

Easy ways to promote spaying and neutering in your neighborhood:

Find out who does low cost/free spaying and neutering in your community and post on Facebook when they are having clinics or specials. Post the information to any local Facebook groups you're in.
Ask to put flyers in the windows or on bulletin boards of feed stores, pet stores (not all of them sell animals), libraries and churches.
If you don't have one in your area, think about starting a program, or approach a local humane society or animal group about starting one. This group can help: SpayUSA.org

 

[FortyTwo]

And yet there are vegans who believe that spaying and neutering pets is "mutilating them against their will" and should never be done.

Just goes to show, again, that you can be vegan and not actually have animals' best interests in mind.

 

[Sentientist]

Hi, I wrote the blogs in question and just found this thread. Jack Norris, a vegan dietician admits that eating oysters and mussels might be the best solution for those who don't thrive on a vegan diet, even when supplemented. Odds and Ends - Jack Norris RD
If you read both my blogs, I go quite a bit into the nutritional reasons. In other contexts I've compared eating oysters and mussels to an environmentally sustainable in vitro meat since it has many of the same fundamental characteristics (e.g. animal protein, nonsentient)

The ethical case for eating oysters and mussels | Sentientist
The Ethical Case for Eating Oysters and Mussels- Part 2 | Sentientist

I don't understand why a scientific taxonomy developed hundreds of years ago is what vegans should decide to hang their ethics on rather than sentience. In one breath vegans will say that science isn't perfect (e.g. Descartes thinking animals are automata) and in the next breath they will say not eating anything from the Kingdom Animalia (a division set up by science without regard to the ability to suffer pain) is what is really important about being vegan.

 

[beancounter]

I don't understand why a scientific taxonomy developed hundreds of years ago is what vegans should decide to hang their ethics on rather than sentience. In one breath vegans will say that science isn't perfect (e.g. Descartes thinking animals are automata) and in the next breath they will say not eating anything from the Kingdom Animalia (a division set up by science without regard to the ability to suffer pain) is what is really important about being vegan.

So, you eat oysters?